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CaptainxBumout

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While I hear everyone's frustrations, I think they are trying to make things more convenient for the consumer. I don't really have much of a problem about the whole used games debacle because I'm almost certain this will backfire. I don't think we even really need physical media anymore. As far as the everything has to be installed, I'm pretty sure they've been doing that with the ps3 since it got released right? And I don't doubt that there won't be excellent games coming out. Despite all the gimmicky hardware, it's still a much more efficient piece of technology for developers and I'm all for them making greater games. I just hope the price tag isn't too high because of all the extra crap like the Kinect. The only reason PC gaming isn't bigger than console gaming is because PC, while better is expensive as shit to get a good rig.
 

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Why would people pay an abundant amount of money for something they can get for much cheaper? I just think Microsoft is a little late to this party.

? What the hell are you talking about? It's still superior to the PS3 in game play and aside from BluRay it had all the features the PS3 had they're only building on it. You know just like every next gen console builds on the previous gen.
 
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While I hear everyone's frustrations, I think they are trying to make things more convenient for the consumer. I don't really have much of a problem about the whole used games debacle because I'm almost certain this will backfire. I don't think we even really need physical media anymore. As far as the everything has to be installed, I'm pretty sure they've been doing that with the ps3 since it got released right? And I don't doubt that there won't be excellent games coming out. Despite all the gimmicky hardware, it's still a much more efficient piece of technology for developers and I'm all for them making greater games. I just hope the price tag isn't too high because of all the extra crap like the Kinect. The only reason PC gaming isn't bigger than console gaming is because PC, while better is expensive as shit to get a good rig.

PC games are dirt cheap. Check out the steam store during a sales period.

As a long term investment, the PC is always more reasonable than a console. Don't forget that you can upgrade your PC whenever you want, as you want.

The fact that this generation of consoles is based on x86 hardware makes the argument for buying them even more specious. They better have some good fucking exclusives, which I'm guessing they will. It's a shame none of them seem to available at launch.
 

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While I hear everyone's frustrations, I think they are trying to make things more convenient for the consumer. I don't really have much of a problem about the whole used games debacle because I'm almost certain this will backfire. I don't think we even really need physical media anymore. As far as the everything has to be installed, I'm pretty sure they've been doing that with the ps3 since it got released right? And I don't doubt that there won't be excellent games coming out. Despite all the gimmicky hardware, it's still a much more efficient piece of technology for developers and I'm all for them making greater games. I just hope the price tag isn't too high because of all the extra crap like the Kinect. The only reason PC gaming isn't bigger than console gaming is because PC, while better is expensive as shit to get a good rig.

I couldn't disagree more with that. Everything about this implies that they have thought about protecting their own interests and (IMO) are slowly reshaping the industry into one which maximizes profit and instead, restricts us.

First off, how does it benefit us to essentially have things like "game licenses" tied to hard-copy games we purchase? Even if they use the excuse that it means we no longer need the disc to play, we lose one of the most convenient advantages that consoles have over PC's in the first place - the ability to lend a game to a friend, as well as the ability to rent a game (granted that's kinda dying out anyway, but this is pretty much the final nail in the coffin). And i'm a bit confused with this always online thing but the fact that they're even strongly considering it and already placing design choices in place has me concerned as is.

You have to consider the fact that this could just be the beginning. I'm sure Microsoft realizes (particularly based on the backlash it received based on Durango rumours) that gamers will only take so much crap. The smart thing for them is to slowly introduce these things, essentially like I said above - slowly reshaping the industry as we know it and at a pace in which people will accept it and it'll all build up.

And I'd argue that we DO need physical discs. Especially dependent on where you live. I'm Australian and right now we're severely overcharged with our games and ESPECIALLY online. Disc releases enable me to import from the UK where we can pay sometimes even half as much as what we would otherwise. I'd shudder to think how much money THEY would be making and how much people in my position would be losing if Microsoft had total control. Its bad enough MS Points are as ridiculous as they are right now. Not to mention the fact that Games on Demand releases are currently released months later and (more importantly) are sold at "recommended retail price" which is generally just plain atrocious as is. The less direct control Microsoft has over that the better IMO.

The other thing is that Microsoft has supposedly been looking into all sorts of different concepts. One concept I remember hearing was that they were looking into having something like the Kinect (which apparently seems to pretty much be a requirement anyway) and it recognising how many people are in the room and disallowing purchased movies from being played without those additional people paying also. Sounds pretty terrible to me, but I wouldn't be the least bit surprised that they'd go for it if/when they could.

Personally I'll be watching intently to see where it goes. I have a 360 and was hoping for backwards compatibilty (i did hear a rumour there will be an additional device instead - we'll see) and pretty much what we have with the 360 - just updated hardware. I'm not liking what I'm seeing here, and at this rate I might not even bother with this generation at all. Still have to wait and see with PS4 since they're basically just rebutting any comparisons with the Xbox One and Wii U has been underwhelming.
 

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I know PC games are cheap but PC's aren't. Well good ones anyways. I have an okay older one that will let me play WoW or Civilization but not Planetside 2. I've never boughten any console title on PC before but I have used Steam a bit. Content is cheap but hardware is not.

When I said they were trying to make things more convenient, I meant that about them throwing everything in it and not their business model. My bad I didn't specify that. I still feel like the whole used debacle will settle itself. It's not so much that I'm complacent with it its just that I'm tired of hearing about people arguing about it. There's a lot we still don't know and people just causing a shit storm with rumors but that's just our culture and journalism in general.

I do agree with you on the physical media. I'd forgotten that over half of the world doesn't even have good network connection. A lot of people still use dial up. I do not mind games on demand feature because some games can be hard to find and I don't want to wait to have a game mailed to me so ill pay $5 extra bucks to get it when I want it. Big wide release games I can agree with as there is really no point to buying them from the Xbox.

A lot of other things I don't mind. I couldn't care less about the movie thing because I don't know anyone who would buy movies off of Xbox. Personally a lot of problems people have are just nitpicks to me. I do hope this is at least as long as the last generation. I don't want to shill out money and have a better console come out in 2 years. One major thing I'm weary about is another red ring debacle. I went through 4 consoles in the past 7 years the 360 has been out. Hopefully nothing like that happens because Microsoft is a pain in the ass to deal with.
 

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When I said they were trying to make things more convenient, I meant that about them throwing everything in it and not their business model. My bad I didn't specify that. I still feel like the whole used debacle will settle itself. It's not so much that I'm complacent with it its just that I'm tired of hearing about people arguing about it. There's a lot we still don't know and people just causing a shit storm with rumors but that's just our culture and journalism in general.

Are you referring to the idea that the console is supposed to be an "entertainment" console and therefore "convenient" in performing multiple functions? In a sense it is, but then all devices are pretty much becoming multi-purpose and i'm not sure if it's even so much a convenience as it is a "necessity" at this point. That and the idea that many of the premium services it boasts aren't "readily" available (which technically is rather inconvenient).

As far as convenience goes, it just strikes me as being "convenience" for Microsoft and other businesses etc that use it for additional profit rather than for the benefit of customers though. It's all presented as convenient features for the customer but ultimately for an additional way to make a profit (on top of likely Gold Membership). Generally most of that entertainment crap is better sought out elsewhere anyway. Maybe that's nitpicking, but to me it's one of many points i'm considering with this new Xbox.

I do agree with you on the physical media. I'd forgotten that over half of the world doesn't even have good network connection. A lot of people still use dial up. I do not mind games on demand feature because some games can be hard to find and I don't want to wait to have a game mailed to me so ill pay $5 extra bucks to get it when I want it. Big wide release games I can agree with as there is really no point to buying them from the Xbox.

It's not just connection though (that was moreso a complaint that people have with the "always online" functionality of it). Pricing is atrocious here. To put it in perspective, US 360 gamers pay roughly $5 for 500 MS points. Aussies pay roughly $3 on top. While $8 may not seem like too much, it really does build up ($15 for 1500 = $24AU), particularly when you consider that unlike a few years ago the Australian Dollar has been consistently better than what it was. Yet nothings changed to reflect that.

While it's been argued that because a country like Australia is smaller and it's less profitable etc and it being the reason why retail games are sold higher in price; why does that excuse online prices where distribution isn't really as much of an issue? THAT is easily my biggest concern. It's been quite clear that Microsoft are perfectly fine overcharging. At least when I import from UK I'm getting games at a far more competitive price. Plus I'm oldschool in that like having a physical game collection.

A lot of other things I don't mind. I couldn't care less about the movie thing because I don't know anyone who would buy movies off of Xbox. Personally a lot of problems people have are just nitpicks to me.

Perhaps. I mean for me it's not like the concept of always online affects me too much since i'm pretty much always online when I play so therefore for me to complain could be seen to be a bit of a nitpick. But it's also on principle. I LIKE having an option to play online or offline for instance. I like the option of sharing with my friends (not allowed without me being present with my profile) and if my friends who'd moved out and not got round to having the net, then I like having a functional console. When I heard rumours that it wouldn't function and more and more rumours supported it (hell there's nothing to say it wasn't their intention until recently) it still annoyed me. It's logical for people to be bothered when stuff like that is potentially imposed on them.

Something like mandatory Kinect is stupid. I got a Kinect cheap as part of a deal like 2 years back. Even if they have improved it, i'm not one to particularly want to be forced to use it. And the thing is I don't see why it's justified, especially if it drives up the cost and I use it about as much as I do my current Kinect (which is practically never unless I set it up for my friends kids to mess around with). That's another rumour that very much bothered people (and still does).

Basically what's annoying me is that I don't like the idea of Microsoft slowly taking away small privileges when essentially some people (even if not myself or even then only in some circumstances) are still reliant on some of the freedoms/capabilities we still currently have with this gen - and especially if they start rescinding those "options" because of some kind of business ideal or to increase their own control in general. In the end we (the people :p) lose out.

Theoretically why have "always online"? How does that "feature" benefit the gamer? As far as I'm concerned that concept is more about control than it is a logical step forward. It's easier to catch modded consoles, stop piracy and micromanage services and consumer actions when they're forced to be online. Even if a lot of functions are only useable online, everything I do could be done offline. The fact that Microsoft openly supports that and is slowly introducing such things I believe is still a legitimate concern. I guess what i'm saying is that i'm considering the larger picture here.
 
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? What the hell are you talking about? It's still superior to the PS3 in game play and aside from BluRay it had all the features the PS3 had they're only building on it. You know just like every next gen console builds on the previous gen.

Alright, so what does Xbox One have that the PS3 doesn't? To me it seems like they literally just took everything the PS3 has, and made it look prettier. Still going to have to pay to play online, which is absolutely insane in my opinion. Twist of Fate is right, all Microsoft is doing is ensuring that they make the most profit without really caring too much about the customer. Xbox 360 is a prime example. They didn't start adding BluRay to it until they noticed they could make a profit off it. Same goes for Netflix which I think PS3 had first. I could be wrong about that though.
 

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I know PC games are cheap but PC's aren't. Well good ones anyways. I have an okay older one that will let me play WoW or Civilization but not Planetside 2. I've never boughten any console title on PC before but I have used Steam a bit. Content is cheap but hardware is not.

When I said they were trying to make things more convenient, I meant that about them throwing everything in it and not their business model. My bad I didn't specify that. I still feel like the whole used debacle will settle itself. It's not so much that I'm complacent with it its just that I'm tired of hearing about people arguing about it. There's a lot we still don't know and people just causing a shit storm with rumors but that's just our culture and journalism in general.

I do agree with you on the physical media. I'd forgotten that over half of the world doesn't even have good network connection. A lot of people still use dial up. I do not mind games on demand feature because some games can be hard to find and I don't want to wait to have a game mailed to me so ill pay $5 extra bucks to get it when I want it. Big wide release games I can agree with as there is really no point to buying them from the Xbox.

A lot of other things I don't mind. I couldn't care less about the movie thing because I don't know anyone who would buy movies off of Xbox. Personally a lot of problems people have are just nitpicks to me. I do hope this is at least as long as the last generation. I don't want to shill out money and have a better console come out in 2 years. One major thing I'm weary about is another red ring debacle. I went through 4 consoles in the past 7 years the 360 has been out. Hopefully nothing like that happens because Microsoft is a pain in the ass to deal with.

THIS. Microsoft is known for making unreliable products, that are lucky to get hardware updates to fix the problems(both Windows & Xboxes have proven this), combine this with the fact everything Microsoft does is ripping off other people(Steve Jobs for the Windows OS, Kinect wasn't even a thought until Nintendo grabbed the casual market with a $200 console, and now the specs for Xbox One being fairly similar with the PS3), I would never imagine buying a Microsoft product until its been out for awhile, and problems have been "fixed"(as you can still red ring on the new model 360's).

The only reason I even got the 360 is because I was into Rock Band at the time, and the price point for the 360 with a full instrument set was the same price as the PS3 itself. Wii never supported the RBN, which is where I was able to find some of my favorite bands that are generally overlooked by EA, like KMFDM, or Powerman 5000.
 

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I'm so glad the PS4 hasn't gone down the same path as the Xbox One's. Just hearing about paying a fee for playing a disk that has already been used is a disgrace. Then add on the fact that you can't take your Xbox One with you somewhere because it needs to be connected to the internet at least once per day? Also having to install what could be a 20 GB game on your XBox before being able to play it is stupid. After a while you're gonna run out of harddrive space and you can't even take the fucking harddrive out because it isnt portable...

What the fuck have they done to my beloved Xbox? PS4 is the future. Fuck the Xbox One. I don't want another iPhone or Computer, I want something that plays games. I'm in absolute shock at how the new Xbox is a money grubbing machine. Definitely won't be buying it unless they get rid of the aforementioned shit above.
 
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Xbox One Does Require Internet Connection, Can’t Play Offline Forever | Kotaku Australia

If that's true, then what a bunch of jerks! I wonder if they actually did change it based on the initial complaints on "always online" and adopted this idea so that people couldn't complain should the net drop out for a while.

“There are many devices in your life that require the internet to function,” he said. “Xbox One is no different in that it requires, at some point in the beginning and at various times through its on state, to connect to our cloud and to our internet. That is to deliver Xbox Live functionality, that is to deliver download content to you, that is to deliver some of the innovations around TV and entertainment that we showed today. But it doesn’t require it to be online all the time.”

What a stupid mindset to have! I don't know about anyone else, but literally NONE of the devices in my house require an internet connection to operate! Not one! The most annoying thing about this is that they're trying to justify it with comments like it being online and "delivering download content to you". Sure, once in a while it might be a good OPTION. Sure it makes sense that you wouldn't have access to TV crap (though honestly how many people actually care and if so, would feel compelled to use the Xbox for that anyway?). But in no way do any of the excuses justify why the console should not operate offline indefinitely.
 
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Alright, so what does Xbox One have that the PS3 doesn't? To me it seems like they literally just took everything the PS3 has, and made it look prettier. Still going to have to pay to play online, which is absolutely insane in my opinion. Twist of Fate is right, all Microsoft is doing is ensuring that they make the most profit without really caring too much about the customer. Xbox 360 is a prime example. They didn't start adding BluRay to it until they noticed they could make a profit off it. Same goes for Netflix which I think PS3 had first. I could be wrong about that though.

360 doesn't have BluRay. Your comparing Xbox one to PS3 why don't you compare it to the Xbox 360 first they way you know somewhat what you're talking about.
 

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I play offline all the time. So what happens of I don't play online at all? An I not allowed to use the system then?

360 doesn't have BluRay. Your comparing Xbox one to PS3 why don't you compare it to the Xbox 360 first they way you know somewhat what you're talking about.

You know about as much of the Xbox One as I do man.
 

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I play offline all the time. So what happens of I don't play online at all? An I not allowed to use the system then?



You know about as much of the Xbox One as I do man.

Yeah but when you make comparisons you ignore the features the 360 HAS. And I'd say I know quite a bit more cause it appears you haven't read the articles at all.
 

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[MENTION=10904]Twist of Fate[/MENTION] I'm not going to quote everything you said and pick apart things because I'm not on a computer but I said they were trying to making things more convenient. I didn't say they were succeeding. I think Microsoft had this conference to get the idea out there, take the backlash and then try and fix things for E3. While a good idea, Microsoft came at it in a very bad way. A lot of people are pissed off about used games but we also don't know PS4's stance on this either. I guess their plan is to see how Microsoft deals with the backlash and adjust accordingly. They could be doing the exact same thing but are being quiet about it.

As far as your other concerns, not to be a dick but I don't care. The Kinect watching me all the time I have a problem with but like I said earlier, I'm just tired of hearing the same arguments. I don't want to listen to people complain all day. Is it bad? Yeah it's bad but a lot of the stuff doesn't affect me so I don't feel the need to voice all the problems when others are doing it for me and better.

[MENTION=2245]Rated R Superstar[/MENTION] the only reason 360 didn't have Blu Ray before is because they picked the wrong horse. PS3 went the Blu route and 360 went HD DVD. Blu won that battle and movies aren't made in that HD DVD format anymore. I'm glad Blu Ray is being added in because I only have one in my living room.