For the people against the "part time" wrestlers

[Dale]

So there still seems to be a whole load of people around who appear to be against guys like The Rock and Brock Lesnar returning for a couple of months on big salaries to be involved in high profile, money making feuds before disappearing again until the next money feud comes around.

So now we're on The Road To Wrestlemania, I'd love to hear what cards you would build that are of WrestleMania quality with the star power and big time matches.

Seen as though Rock and Brock are banished for being part timers, let's also banish The Undertaker and HHH seen as though those two definitely work less than The Rock. Let's also add Jericho to this list seen as though he's now a part timer these days.

Who are your champions heading into Mania, who won the Rumble etc.

 

[Chris]

Oh this should have some hilarious replies.

For the record, I'm not against part-time big name guys in the slightest, I think they help loads, but I do believe WWE's booking them terrible. Rock's been booked fairly well whether we like to admit it or not, great build-up for his matches against Cena & Punk with good payoffs as well. Lesnar, Trips, & 'Taker on the other hand have not been used as well as they should have the last few years. Even though I enjoyed both matches, I don't think we should have had Trips/Taker twice in a row, build-up was boring as hell both times. Lesnar definitely shouldn't have lost to Cena when he returned, and then won against HHH then suddenly quit. If anything it should have been the opposite, he wins against Cena and he quits out of spite after losing to Trips.

As for how they should be booked, honestly can't tell you. WWE's in a tight spot lately, really don't have that much to do it seems.

 

[Defiant]

Its not old wrestlers popping up occasionally in and of itself that gets to me, it's when I realise it is or will be pointless or disappointing that I begin to roll my eyes. There are things about the way, for example, The Rock has been used that I like and things that I didn't like. I thought the majority of Rock/Cena's interactions were wastes of time or unnecessary and mostly due to Rock being too silly. I also LOVE the Punk/Rock fued and mostly due to Rock being more awesome. He makes time for jokes, but overal hel seems far more focused and by treating Punk as more of a dangerous opponent Rock gives himself a mountain to climb and gets himself and Punk over by doing so. It works SO much better and didn't need to take anywhere near as long to build up. I was actually happy when Rock won the title, even if the match finish was overbooked.

... The crushing disappontment comes when I look over at John Cena's Royal Rumble win and we all know where the fuck this is going. Ask anyone here and they'll say they are 99% certain that Cena is gonna get his feel good rematch victory. I could go on and on about why having all of this amounting to another notch in Cena's belt just feels like a gigantic "fuck you" to 40-50% of the audience who regularly boo's him, but what I will say is that all these fans who tuned back in to see The Rock come back and change things or make things better will be equally disappointed and leave again, probably more bitter about the product than before.

It doesn't matter if Rock's presence gets more viewers familiar with Dolph Ziggler or whatever, WWE keeps unwittingly sending the message that it almost doesn't want those people to be stars. Rather, they seem to like fads. For every time we get see a breakthrough from a Miz or a Ryback, it seems to always comes back to Cena. He may have spent the past year putting people over, but WWE were clearly afraid to take him out of the spotlight.

It all comes down to WWE's lack of willingness to take real risks anymore and, like I said in the RR thread, weak writers who do a poor job overall of booking wrestlers in interesting scenarios and fueds in favor of comedy skits.

 

[Dod Draper]

Kofi Kingston vs Wade Barrett - 60 Minute Ironman match for the WWE Championship

 

[Tapout]

Ryback should have won the Rumble, easily. I'd have Punk lose to Cena, seeing how Rock wouldn't be in the picture anymore. This would set up Cena vs. Ryback for the title.

The World Championship could easily be changed between Ziggler, Big Show, Sheamus, or Del Rio, as I think all would draw just about the same. And you could make any WrestleMania Main Event between the four of the them. Sheamus vs. Ziggler would be the best match, I think.

I don't think it's fair to exclude the Undertaker. Yes, he only wrestles part time but is a main stay at WrestleMania, and doesn't have an ego the size of the Rocks. Taker comes back for one match, and stays out of the title picture. I would have him face Punk.

Kane and Bryan will fall out and lead to a match at WrestleMania that would have a pretty good build.

So right now thats:

Cena vs. Ryback for the WWE Title
Sheamus vs. Ziggler for the World Title
Punk vs. Undertaker
Kane vs. Bryan.

That right there looks good and doesn't feature any of the part times, bar the Undertaker.

Then Big Show could work with almost anyone. You could throw in a US title match, Tag Title Match, and IC title match, and I think that's a pretty good WrestleMania.

 

[Dale]

Looks good? You take out The Undertaker and you've got yourself a run of the mill PPV. That aint WrestleMania calibre.

And do tell me why The Rock has an ego problem.

 

[Tapout]

Looks good? You take out The Undertaker and you've got yourself a run of the mill PPV. That aint WrestleMania calibre.

How the hell do you plan on advancing stars if you have the mind set that EVERY WrestleMania has to feature past superstars just to draw a rating. Some WrestleManias will be less important because you have to build a star to get to be a main draw. If they just keep pumping the old timers, then the superstars here won't be able to draw because they were never allowed too.

 

[Chris]

Ryback should have won the Rumble, easily. I'd have Punk lose to Cena, seeing how Rock wouldn't be in the picture anymore. This would set up Cena vs. Ryback for the title.

The World Championship could easily be changed between Ziggler, Big Show, Sheamus, or Del Rio, as I think all would draw just about the same. And you could make any WrestleMania Main Event between the four of the them. Sheamus vs. Ziggler would be the best match, I think.

I don't think it's fair to exclude the Undertaker. Yes, he only wrestles part time but is a main stay at WrestleMania, and doesn't have an ego the size of the Rocks. Taker comes back for one match, and stays out of the title picture. I would have him face Punk.

Kane and Bryan will fall out and lead to a match at WrestleMania that would have a pretty good build.

So right now thats:

Cena vs. Ryback for the WWE Title
Sheamus vs. Ziggler for the World Title
Punk vs. Undertaker
Kane vs. Bryan.

That right there looks good and doesn't feature any of the part times, bar the Undertaker.

Then Big Show could work with almost anyone. You could throw in a US title match, Tag Title Match, and IC title match, and I think that's a pretty good WrestleMania.

Probably would be enjoyable to watch, but realistically nothing close to that will happen because it ain't 'Mania and it'd have shitty buyrates.

 

[Defiant]

Kofi Kingston vs Wade Barrett - 60 Minute Ironman match for the WWE Championship

As they are now, no, of course not. But give them a few years, focus on them, develop them, book them in interesting storylines and entertaining scenarios, give them gimmicks and occasional angles with legends. If you have the talent and a booker who knows what to do with them, you can have a solid show. That's how wrestling works.

Imagine if WWE really sticks to Ryback like they are now for another year or two? By then, you'll have a guy who's over enough and has been developed enough to be in high-profile main events that people want to see. The Miz, also, was once the hottest thing going in WWE despite how unremarkable most of us know he really is. But imagine if WWE really stuck to him after his Wrestlemania victory and breaking away from Alex Riley? Tell me the main event scene today wouldn't look a bit different. What if WWE had stuck with Wade Barrett after leaving Nexus? Or Kofi after going over Orton?

But no. Like I said in my last post, WWE seem to be content with fads. Never committing to anything for too long or going too out of their comfort zone, only a little bit. And we keep getting these wrestlers, talented in their own different ways, coming and going. Glimpses of potential never being fully realised while John Cena remains THE star. And the wrestlers of the past remain THE stars. It's why 20 years on, Undertaker remains THE star of Wrestlemania each year. It is a cynical and depressing cycle that truly frustrates me every time it comes full circle.

And, once again, I choose to blame WWE for this, not any of the wrestlers I mentioned.

 

[SAIYANS]

No one is paying $70 to watch that at home or hundreds of dollars for in stadium seats and thousands for travel packages. No stars are flocking to sit in that audience. None of the casuals who hardly ever tune in but buy are doing so with that card.

 

[The Cork]

The whole thing is just so, so weird.

You have Jericho, a guy whos tried every possible backdoor to leave the wrestling business for good, then when he fails as a musician/TV presenter/host comes crawling back to wrestling. I haven't seen one word doubting his commitment to the business despite all of this.

You have the Undertaker, whos been on the easiest schedule in wrestling for nearly a decade, and only bothers to show up two dates annually to claim his next victim and steal a paycheck. No badmouthing this guy either, despite being the most predictable wrestler ever.

Then you have The Rock, who actually bothers to appear on the shows in between shooting films, even appearing on Smackdown which nobody cares about, and yet his commitment is the one questioned?

It's like some of you guys harbour a grudge against anyone to make a success out of themselves. Just because precious Punk grafted for 10 years for his spot he apparently has some entitlement to beat one of the G.O.A.T's. The stuff about Punk shouldn't have lost to a Peoples Elbow is laughable and pathetic.

As for making a card out of WWE's shitty roster, yeah good luck with that. Smark fantasy booking might work in Universe mode on WWE 13 but it gets no buys in real life. Try spinning Ziggler vs Punk as a legit headline act and see how long it takes before you get laughed out of their offices in Stamford.

 

[Keith]

The whole thing is just so, so weird.

You have Jericho, a guy whos tried every possible backdoor to leave the wrestling business for good, then when he fails as a musician/TV presenter/host comes crawling back to wrestling. I haven't seen one word doubting his commitment to the business despite all of this.

You have the Undertaker, whos been on the easiest schedule in wrestling for nearly a decade, and only bothers to show up two dates annually to claim his next victim and steal a paycheck. No badmouthing this guy either, despite being the most predictable wrestler ever.

Then you have The Rock, who actually bothers to appear on the shows in between shooting films, even appearing on Smackdown which nobody cares about, and yet his commitment is the one questioned?

It's like some of you guys harbour a grudge against anyone to make a success out of themselves. Just because precious Punk grafted for 10 years for his spot he apparently has some entitlement to beat one of the G.O.A.T's. The stuff about Punk shouldn't have lost to a Peoples Elbow is laughable and pathetic.

As for making a card out of WWE's shitty roster, yeah good luck with that. Smark fantasy booking might work in Universe mode on WWE 13 but it gets no buys in real life. Try spinning Ziggler vs Punk as a legit headline act and see how long it takes before you get laughed out of their offices in Stamford.

Ok then tell me what happens when the likes of The Rock, Lesnar and Taker retire or leave the company which is going to happen sooner rather than later? Then WWE will be back to square one because they didn't use those guys elevate younger talent. That is why they need to be thinking long term, not just for a quick easy fix, which has always been my point.

 

[AF.]

Not against the part-timers but if I had to make a money WM card it would probably be:

WWE Title:
John Cena vs. Randy Orton (C) (Heel)

Street Fight:
CM Punk vs. Ryback

World Heavyweight Title:
Alberto Del Rio vs. Rey Mysterio vs. Sin Cara

United States Title:
Daniel Bryan vs. Antonio Cesaro (C)

The Shield vs. Kane, Miz and Big Show (I hate Show as a heel)

Grudge Match:
Sheamus vs. Dolph Ziggler (Plenty of ways this could be made a high profile feud/match)

 

[Embrace Thou Maryse]

The part timers bring media attention and bring back old fans, more people will pay to see Rock or Brock vs anyone than would pay to see Punk v Bryan. If WWE is smart while they have these big names around and push the up and comers it'll get them established.

Not against the part-timers but if I had to make a money WM card it would probably be:

WWE Title:
John Cena vs. Randy Orton (C) (Heel)

Street Fight:
CM Punk vs. Ryback

World Heavyweight Title:
Alberto Del Rio vs. Rey Mysterio vs. Sin Cara

United States Title:
Daniel Bryan vs. Antonio Cesaro (C)

The Shield vs. Kane, Miz and Big Show (I hate Show as a heel)

Grudge Match:
Sheamus vs. Dolph Ziggler (Plenty of ways this could be made a high profile feud/match)

Sorry but thats an awful card.

We've seen Cena-Orton a thousand times before. Punk v Ryback has happened numerous times in just the last couple of months. Thw WHC match is just throwing all the Mexicans together. Bryan-Cesaro would be good. And Sheamus has squashed Ziggler enough over the last year, we dont need to see Sheamus beat him in 10 seconds at Mania.

 

[Embrace Thou Maryse]

Ryback should have won the Rumble, easily. I'd have Punk lose to Cena, seeing how Rock wouldn't be in the picture anymore. This would set up Cena vs. Ryback for the title.

The World Championship could easily be changed between Ziggler, Big Show, Sheamus, or Del Rio, as I think all would draw just about the same. And you could make any WrestleMania Main Event between the four of the them. Sheamus vs. Ziggler would be the best match, I think.

I don't think it's fair to exclude the Undertaker. Yes, he only wrestles part time but is a main stay at WrestleMania, and doesn't have an ego the size of the Rocks. Taker comes back for one match, and stays out of the title picture. I would have him face Punk.

Kane and Bryan will fall out and lead to a match at WrestleMania that would have a pretty good build.

So right now thats:

Cena vs. Ryback for the WWE Title
Sheamus vs. Ziggler for the World Title
Punk vs. Undertaker
Kane vs. Bryan.

That right there looks good and doesn't feature any of the part times, bar the Undertaker.

Then Big Show could work with almost anyone. You could throw in a US title match, Tag Title Match, and IC title match, and I think that's a pretty good WrestleMania.

I dont get this whole 'Rock has an ego' thing, is Dwayne secretly booking the WWE? Is he the new WWE writer, or is he the CEO? I'm pretty sure it would have been a company decision to put the title on The Rock because end of the day Rock as Champ is a bigger draw than anyone else in the wrestling industry. Bigger than Punk and his year long reign, bigger than HHH and his 20 reigns, bigger than Jericho, Cena, Ryback, Sheamus, Orton, bigger than Taker and his one word but 20 minute long promos every week for 2 months leading up to Mania every year.