Am I Just Burned Out?

[Mike Thunder]

The problem with the current era is they try to compete with the currently highly popular combat sports by trying to be more real than them.
In the past it was always "Maybe you are real but you will never have characters like Warrior, Hogan, Rock, Savage, Sting and that's why people will always watch us". Today it's "Maybe you are real but we will be more real".
Today the most storylines are "2 guys fighting to show who is the best athlete" all the tournaments, UK tournaments, cruiserweight tournaments, women tournaments, finding out who is the better man, they try too much to be real hoping to get more fans who already watch MMA but the problem is nobody wants this crap. if you can have a choice between a real fight between 2 guys who want to find out who is the best athlete and a scripted fight where competitors pretend to do that what would you watch? People need over the top entertainment to chose the "fake shit" over a real fight.
Everybody knew what Hogan did back then was only show but his charisma, storylines and entertainment made the people choose this "fake fighter" over 2 boring real fighters. Today WWE tries to compete agains 2 boring real fighters with 2 boring fake fighters

People compare this era to the New Generation era, no, no matter how embarrassing WWF 1995 was at least they tried to entertain, no matter how much it sucked. This right here is AWA during the last days shit

I disagree with you. I enjoy watching realistic professional wrestling more than over the top characters. It's just a matter of personal taste. In fact, realistic pro wrestling is very hot right now. Just look at NJPW. It's arguably the best wrestling company in the world and it treats wrestling as a serious sport.

 

[DualShock]

I disagree with you. I enjoy watching realistic professional wrestling more than over the top characters. It's just a matter of personal taste. In fact, realistic pro wrestling is very hot right now. Just look at NJPW. It's arguably the best wrestling company in the world and it treats wrestling as a serious sport.

My post was more WWE related because the actual style isn't very WWE like. It's more like indy wrestling on a bigger stage or the american version of New Japan.
Maybe because serious wrestling is more appreciated in Japan and Mexico or maybe there is a reason why that style of pro wrestling in USA never made it beyond the indy leagues in smaller arenas. I mean, WWE had great wrestlers in the past like Bret, Angle, Benoit, Jericho, Owen but this right now is more and more the "300 superkicks and 500 finishers in 10 minutes" level htath as nothing to do with the great pro wrestling we once knew in WWE (example the SmackDown Six in 2002)
or to quote Randy Orton: Dive

 

[Gman003]

I'm actually somewhat surprised at the feedback this thread got. Kind of relieving to know how many other people are just as over WWE.

All in all, it seems like the main problem is not enough entertainment anymore and too much 'sport'. I'd agree. If every story line is constantly the same, it gets very stale. The creative needs to do something to get interest back up. But sadly, they probably won't because wwe is such a massive company they'll draw attendance no matter what. Especially wrestlemania, RR, and Summerslam

 

[Zardnaar]

Its not to much sport just shit booking.

The actual good WWE has more sport (NXT, UK special).

 

[Gman003]

That's what I kind of meant by too much 'sport'. Because you can have guys losing a feud or splitting a feud and make the story lines captivating enough that it's still OK for a certain guy to lose sometimes. But now days it's just about who's the better fake fighter. And as soon as they win the belt then they're the best! Until the next night when they start another feud over the same. Damn. Thing. The next guy is the best wrestler. And it's a stale cycle that keeps turning.

They need to make awesome story lines that engage people and have them excited.

My buddy and I got talking about this very thing yesterday out of the blue. He was over for mania and I hadn't seen him since and he asked me yesterday if I still watch wwe, to which I responded no not since the shake up really. I'll catch the odd ppv or recaps but not really watching much. And he said the same thing. It has just run its course. Even with the new talent in the past 2 years, it's just so bad. The booking, lack of good story's, bringing in new guys to build them up and crumble them immediately. It's old. Bring in some new creative. Guys and girls who have a knack for writing compelling stories and take the shows back to what made them so popular 20 years ago and try to run with it. Their audience is mostly people from those years anyway, might as well see if it can help boost ratings again.

 

[Gman003]

So being worn out by current-day wwe I made the choice to go back in time and revisit my childhood. Back to January 1998. Started the year off with 2 episodes of RAW then the Royal Rumble now onto the third raw.

And I have to say...

God damn, what ever happened to that creative group? Why can't they seem to master or captivate the way they did then?
Everything, although scripted as much as it is, feels so natural. Down the the matches and how they play out. There's constantly something going on, and the characters truly feel like extensions of the people playing them. Not some highly scripted muscle head that has bad acting skills. And the stage setup, my God! To me personally, less is more. The more dressed down your producton is, the more authentic it feels. This one massive screen, bordered by 2 giant sheets, with the rickety looking scaffolding and a rather plain looking metal stage/ramp is worth more to me than all of these lights and dozens of mini screens and video stage/ramp. It just feels so much like a presentation that it feels forced all around.

Go back to your fucking roots. Go back to the shit that made people want more and more! While still keeping it somewhat pg if you must. Have captivating characters that actually mean something.


I don't know, maybe it's just me. But whatever happened along the way really sucks and it's a shame that the wwe will never ever be the same as it once was.


[HASHTAG]#MakeWWEgreatAgain[/HASHTAG]

 

[Zardnaar]

So being worn out by current-day wwe I made the choice to go back in time and revisit my childhood. Back to January 1998. Started the year off with 2 episodes of RAW then the Royal Rumble now onto the third raw.

And I have to say...

God damn, what ever happened to that creative group? Why can't they seem to master or captivate the way they did then?
Everything, although scripted as much as it is, feels so natural. Down the the matches and how they play out. There's constantly something going on, and the characters truly feel like extensions of the people playing them. Not some highly scripted muscle head that has bad acting skills. And the stage setup, my God! To me personally, less is more. The more dressed down your producton is, the more authentic it feels. This one massive screen, bordered by 2 giant sheets, with the rickety looking scaffolding and a rather plain looking metal stage/ramp is worth more to me than all of these lights and dozens of mini screens and video stage/ramp. It just feels so much like a presentation that it feels forced all around.

Go back to your fucking roots. Go back to the shit that made people want more and more! While still keeping it somewhat pg if you must. Have captivating characters that actually mean something.


I don't know, maybe it's just me. But whatever happened along the way really sucks and it's a shame that the wwe will never ever be the same as it once was.


[HASHTAG]#MakeWWEgreatAgain[/HASHTAG]

I started in 1998 a few months back and are up to 1998. They can't go back to the sex and violence but there are elements of the E they can use. What happened? Patterson retired, Vince got old, lighting for the 1st and only time struck twice (Austin+Rock at same time), and VInce Russo (a pox on his name) did one thing right- ha made sure the lower card and mid card had stories.

Its also interesting in how they got new stars over. They would put them in tag matches or otherwise interact with the main stars. THe big WWE stars these days are all part timers or have recently retired (taker).

The had about 5 or 6 main eventers back then and although Rock/Austin were the big ones Kane, Mankind, Taker, all plausible contenders and they could have built up Shamrock for example. Later on HHH, Jericho, Angle, Giant all turned up or were pushed.

 

[DualShock]

So being worn out by current-day wwe I made the choice to go back in time and revisit my childhood. Back to January 1998. Started the year off with 2 episodes of RAW then the Royal Rumble now onto the third raw.

And I have to say...

God damn, what ever happened to that creative group?

Both are hated now by the fans because they killed pro wrestling and now the fans enjoy the great shows by WWE brought to you by Mr. McMahon because if Vince McMahon was known in the 90s as someone who filtered stupid storylines made by shitty writers then he is capable to do the same with the current writers

 

[Gman003]

Both what are hated by fans? Creative groups?

 

[DualShock]

With both I mean Vince Russo the headwriter and later, mid 1998, Ed Ferrara. Mid 1998 and all the way until both left for WCW the creative team consisted only of 2 guys, Vince Russo and Ed Ferrara

 

[Zardnaar]

Vince Russo is over rated, McMann kept a bit of his stupidity in check and there were others behind the scene like Patterson, Michaels etc who had ideas about the AE. Hell Cornette came up with Kane.

As I said the only thing Russo did right was storylines for the lower and mid card, McMann was more or less all about the Rock.Austin at the time.

Russo tried to take credit for everything.

 

[Gman003]

Ah ok. Basically all my rantime was saying was I wish modern day creative could find that type of magic in today's industry.

And oddly enough, I felt like we caught a glimpse into the past with the end of the reigns/strowman ambulance match last night. It really felt like an insane angle.

 

[Black Iron PJ]

So being worn out by current-day wwe I made the choice to go back in time and revisit my childhood. Back to January 1998. Started the year off with 2 episodes of RAW then the Royal Rumble now onto the third raw.

And I have to say...

God damn, what ever happened to that creative group? Why can't they seem to master or captivate the way they did then?
Everything, although scripted as much as it is, feels so natural. Down the the matches and how they play out. There's constantly something going on, and the characters truly feel like extensions of the people playing them. Not some highly scripted muscle head that has bad acting skills. And the stage setup, my God! To me personally, less is more. The more dressed down your producton is, the more authentic it feels. This one massive screen, bordered by 2 giant sheets, with the rickety looking scaffolding and a rather plain looking metal stage/ramp is worth more to me than all of these lights and dozens of mini screens and video stage/ramp. It just feels so much like a presentation that it feels forced all around.

Go back to your fucking roots. Go back to the shit that made people want more and more! While still keeping it somewhat pg if you must. Have captivating characters that actually mean something.


I don't know, maybe it's just me. But whatever happened along the way really sucks and it's a shame that the wwe will never ever be the same as it once was.


[HASHTAG]#MakeWWEgreatAgain[/HASHTAG]

There's a lot of factors for why 1998 WWF was so different than current WWE.
-Creative was literally just McMahon. Russo, Patterson and maybe someone else. This gave complete focus on what they wanted to book and create, now it's a whole staff along with Triple H and Stephanie, a case of too many cooks in a kitchen.
-WCW, both companies were literally bending over backwards to get your attention so that they can get higher ratings. WWE back then had to have ever minute be filled with engage TV, sure it was Trash TV, but it worked. If you hated the direction the WWF was heading, then you can switch to WCW. If you hated both than welcome to ECW, a promotion that had more fire and energy than TNA and ROH will ever have.
-Because the creative staff was lessened, that meant wrestlers had to do WHATEVER was needed to stay over. This meant everyone was committed to their gimmicks, because most of them made their gimmicks. Stone Cold was Steve Austin's idea, The Rock was Dwayne Johnson's idea. Triple H's 1999 run directly mirrors CM Punk's 2011 run, both started the year as stable leaders, both ended it as WWE Champion, and both began their true rise to the main event by cutting ties with their stable and cutting a promo where they expressed their frustration with the company, and how they were treated and both gave themselves nicknames that they'll forever be known by (The Game and The Best In The World). Why do I bring this up? Because Triple H transitioned to the main event with a character he made born from his frustration with the company, CM Punk did the excat same thing later and it show it still works to have your wrestlers come up with their own characters.

 

[Gman003]

Yeah I was fortunate enough to remember how the landscape looked back then, I may not have watched every week, but talk at school the next day filled everyone in lol. I might have only been 8 during the time frame that I'm currently on, but man I do remember it like it was last year.

I gyes it slips away from me at times that it was totally different scenarios. Like stated, the Monday night wars meant they had to go all-in every minute to keep eyes on them.

Competition is healthy for everyone involved... it just sucks that there isn't much competition on their level at the moment.

Maybe one day they'll be forced to amp it up, but until then I'll keep filled in on what's going on, and mostly stick to reliving my childhood lol

 

[DualShock]

Vince Russo is over rated, McMann kept a bit of his stupidity in check and there were others behind the scene like Patterson, Michaels etc who had ideas about the AE. Hell Cornette came up with Kane.

As I said the only thing Russo did right was storylines for the lower and mid card, McMann was more or less all about the Rock.Austin at the time.

Russo tried to take credit for everything.

No, he is not overrated, how can Russo be overrated when he still holds the record after 20 long years as the most successful WWE writer and headwriter in history?
No, Russo doesn't try to take credit for everything. Have you ever listened to him or are you just jumping on the Russo bash wagon because it's the cool thing to do?
Vince McMahon can't be responsible for Stone Cold and The Rock simply because those characters and their storylines were not his style. McMahon is known for the style like Super Cena, Super Roman, patriotic hogan, patriotic Luger, USA vs the rest of the world, clowns, plumbers.
Somebody like McMahon who is known for those things because that's his type of humor, entertainment, pro wrestling, can't be responsible for a drunk redneck who gets cheered for doing bad things, a corporate Champion who owned the babyfaces on the mic, Sable, Godfather, Ministry of Darkness, Gangrel etc. The best example that he can't be behind the Attitude Era is when he sent Paul Heyman home prior to the ECW December to Dismember 2006 and took over and instead of giving the fans a show that has that ECW style he booked a typical WWE Sports entertainment nonsense.

When Cornette was in the creative Glen Jacobs was a dentist and fake Diesel. Cornette's only contribution during the Attitude Era or WWE in general during his 10-15 year tenure was "hey why not give the steel cage a roof".

Patterson was great at booking but that had nothing to do with writing Russo was responsible for.
There is a clip on YouTube how the same Shawn Michaels you have mentioned is giving credit to Russo why he was so successful during the late 1997 early 1998.

Russo didn't create Steve Austin and The Rock because there is nobody in the world who could give them charisma, instensity, personality but Russo's strength was always giving the wrestlers the right storyline. It was the talent that made both Rock and Austin successful and legends but both would be lost if they didn't have the right storylines.

McMahon, Hayes, Cornette, Patterson, Brisco and others in the creative were smart, creative guys who contributed to the business a lot in the 80s but they were all lost in the 90s. They didn't know how to deal with the society, they didn't know how to deal with WCW kicking their ass, they didn't know how to deal with the new style of pro wrestling made popular by ECW, they didn't know that the society was more edgy with shows like South Park, Jerry Springer and Howard Stern being the popular shows, that's why he put his magazine writer on the creative, it's because he was the only worker employed by WWE who understood how the society worked back then.
Russo knew how the sociey worked back then, what people wanted and how to change things to make WWE part of the group that was popular in the mainstream.

There is an interesting story Vince Russo told once that explains everything why WWE sucked in mid 90s and why WWE sucks now. When Russo just started as part of the creative the nWo was founded and WCW became more popular than WWE. So one time he was in the office thinking about what to do to beat WCW with their nWo storyline he found a map with future storylines made by other people in the creative. Jim Neidhart was already in WWE with his new gimmick, a masked wrestler named Who, so the big story how to compete with WCW, heel Hogan and nWo was to introduce the brother of Who named What. That's why WWE sucks for years and that's why WWE never had a new Vince Russo because 10 years ago when Breaking Bad started and Heisenberg was the Stone Cold of TV shows at the same time WWE had the face of the company spraying "JBL is poopy" on a car. That explains all, especially the problem and the answer to the question of this topic.