What If? - The Screwjob Never Happened

[Solid Snake]

Don't feel bad. I was 22 when all this happened and I didn't know most of this stuff until recent years. I had always sided with Vince with regards to the screwjob because I can understand how terrified Vince must have been after Madusa left with the women's belt. I mean, if Bret left with the belt, that could have been the end of the WWF.

It was only actually through reading a lot of information from guys like Bret, Vader, Meltzer and several others that I began seeing it from a different picture. And of course Bischoff explaining that he was told that he could never show a WWF belt on Nitro again because apparently Turner Sports was not happy with the Madusa thing at all. So it seemed like for at least once in his life, Bischoff wasn't going to take the low road and Vince took the lower one.

I completely forgot about Madusa walking with the title. This makes more sense now. It was all shady what they were doing to each other but Vince being the petty man that he can be took the even lower road like you said. Wrestling back then was more of a turf war so I am sure a lot of screw jobs happened that we didn't even know about.

 

[Jay-Ashley]

Bret would have kept the belt and then vacant it the next day and head to WCW where he would have a meh run. That is what would have happened, and Bret might still have liked wrestling and not been like this just a job now.

P.E. If you want to know more about Bret and Vince then read his book, watch a couple of his interviews, and one of his DVDs and you will understand everything better.

 

[Jacob Fox]

Bret would have kept the belt and then vacant it the next day and head to WCW where he would have a meh run. That is what would have happened, and Bret might still have liked wrestling and not been like this just a job now.

P.E. If you want to know more about Bret and Vince then read his book, watch a couple of his interviews, and one of his DVDs and you will understand everything better.

Yeah, I think one of the biggest things about this is Bret's character. I mean Vince knew him for like 20 years and really should have known that he was a man of his word and wouldn't have done that to him. Honestly, I think that if Shawn Michaels had not been such a strong voice in McMahon's ear, Vince would have trusted Bret like he should have.

Bret's character has been defended by a LOT of people who knew him and it seems that almost no one thought Bret would leave with the belt. It seemed like a delusion McMahon had that was reinforced by that lowlife, Shawn Michaels.

 

[Jay-Ashley]

Yeah, I think one of the biggest things about this is Bret's character. I mean Vince knew him for like 20 years and really should have known that he was a man of his word and wouldn't have done that to him. Honestly, I think that if Shawn Michaels had not been such a strong voice in McMahon's ear, Vince would have trusted Bret like he should have.

Bret's character has been defended by a LOT of people who knew him and it seems that almost no one thought Bret would leave with the belt. It seemed like a delusion McMahon had that was reinforced by that lowlife, Shawn Michaels.

Bret has said that the only reason Vince believed Shawn was because he was in The Clique and they basically ran WWF behind the scenes, and trust me Bret isn't the only one to have said this. Also, anyone who knew Bret like you said knew he was a man of his word and wouldn't have carried the belt to WCW and in fact would have just dropped it. Bret personally didn't want to lose to Shawn or give him the belt because he thought Shawn was the embodiment of everything wrong with wrestling at the time including WWF.

Majority of the people backstage knew he wouldn't leave with the belt because Bret knew that would be in bad taste as well as the fact The Undertaker of all people was on Bret's side and was in Gorilla position ready to knock out Shawn before security came. As for the delusion that wasn't much of the case as much as Bret pissing off everyone in The Clique for calling out their bs like Kevin not caring for wrestling, Scott just there and not caring, Triple H showing no respect to no one and thought he was better, and Shawn who he thought would be the death of wrestling in a sense due to the showboating and behind the scenes politics. Again, I know a lot of this because of Bret being my favorite of all time and reading and watching a lot of his media.

 

[Jacob Fox]

Bret has said that the only reason Vince believed Shawn was because he was in The Clique and they basically ran WWF behind the scenes, and trust me Bret isn't the only one to have said this. Also, anyone who knew Bret like you said knew he was a man of his word and wouldn't have carried the belt to WCW and in fact would have just dropped it. Bret personally didn't want to lose to Shawn or give him the belt because he thought Shawn was the embodiment of everything wrong with wrestling at the time including WWF.

Majority of the people backstage knew he wouldn't leave with the belt because Bret knew that would be in bad taste as well as the fact The Undertaker of all people was on Bret's side and was in Gorilla position ready to knock out Shawn before security came. As for the delusion that wasn't much of the case as much as Bret pissing off everyone in The Clique for calling out their bs like Kevin not caring for wrestling, Scott just there and not caring, Triple H showing no respect to no one and thought he was better, and Shawn who he thought would be the death of wrestling in a sense due to the showboating and behind the scenes politics. Again, I know a lot of this because of Bret being my favorite of all time and reading and watching a lot of his media.

Funny thing is, I've never been an Undertaker guy. But the fact that he actually FORCED Vince McMahon to come out of his office and forced him to go to Bret to apologize made me like Mark as a person.

And yeah, I know what the Clique was up to. It's one of the main reasons I first start disliking Michaels. Then I began liking him again... and then I met him...

 

[Jay-Ashley]

Funny thing is, I've never been an Undertaker guy. But the fact that he actually FORCED Vince McMahon to come out of his office and forced him to go to Bret to apologize made me like Mark as a person.

And yeah, I know what the Clique was up to. It's one of the main reasons I first start disliking Michaels. Then I began liking him again... and then I met him...

Yeah, that was pretty great and Undertaker held a grudge against The Clique as well due to the Screwjob, which is cool. I agree I was never a fan of Undertaker until American Badass so hate me, but after hearing stories about him. I became a fan of him

The Clique is why I hate Triple H, Michaels, Nash, and Hall. Sean is excluded because he is a pretty cool guy.

 

[WrestleRacer91]

I had no idea this topic was already asked a few years back. My bad.

Link - What IF The Montreal Screwjob NEVER HAVE BEEN!?

 

[Doxo]

I had no idea this topic was already asked a few years back. My bad.

Link - What IF The Montreal Screwjob NEVER HAVE BEEN!?

I'm pretty sure you're good, four years is an okay wait time lol

 

[Grievous 3D]

Did anyone here ever read those WHAT IF? Marvel comics?

I liked the "What if Norman Osborn won the Siege on Asgard?" issue...
but then the Sentry is one of my all time favorite characters in comics.

 

[Zardnaar]

It's actually not completely clear. His contract gave him "reasonable creative control." He claimed that meant he didn't have to drop the title in Canada but Vince has said that he didn't interpret it the same way since he saw that as "unreasonable." They really should have been clearer about it in the contract.

Vince handled it badly but wanting Bret to drop the belt is reasonable to me. Vince is the promoter, owner and operator. The reasonable part would be in how it is dropped basically you don't get jobbed out. Basically to me being reasonable would be able to refuse to do anything that makes you look foolish (squashed, being made to do a stupid segment etc).
[doublepost=1536055520][/doublepost]WCW would sill go under that was self inflicted.

 

[Jacob Fox]

Vince handled it badly but wanting Bret to drop the belt is reasonable to me. Vince is the promoter, owner and operator. The reasonable part would be in how it is dropped basically you don't get jobbed out. Basically to me being reasonable would be able to refuse to do anything that makes you look foolish (squashed, being made to do a stupid segment etc).
[doublepost=1536055520][/doublepost]WCW would sill go under that was self inflicted.

I always felt it was more than reasonable for Vince to have Bret drop the belt. It's really the main reason I took Vince's side early in the fallout. I mean, if things went the way Bret suggested, it could have been bad for WWE. He wanted to surrender the belt on Raw rather than lose it in the ring. I guarantee you that if that happened, Bischoff would have written an angle where he suggested that no one in the WWF could beat Bret for the belt.

I can actually sympathize with Vince to a degree. But Bret offered many times before Survivor Series to drop the belt afterwards. Although technically Bret was not under contract and WOULD have been under contract to WCW, Bischoff gave him permission to wrestle in WWF to drop the belt.

It's only when I found out that Bret actually offered to do a lot of things besides lose to Shawn Michaels in Canada that Vince's actions become unreasonable. Bret gave him plenty of options but Vince didn't take them.

 

[Zardnaar]

I always felt it was more than reasonable for Vince to have Bret drop the belt. It's really the main reason I took Vince's side early in the fallout. I mean, if things went the way Bret suggested, it could have been bad for WWE. He wanted to surrender the belt on Raw rather than lose it in the ring. I guarantee you that if that happened, Bischoff would have written an angle where he suggested that no one in the WWF could beat Bret for the belt.

I can actually sympathize with Vince to a degree. But Bret offered many times before Survivor Series to drop the belt afterwards. Although technically Bret was not under contract and WOULD have been under contract to WCW, Bischoff gave him permission to wrestle in WWF to drop the belt.

It's only when I found out that Bret actually offered to do a lot of things besides lose to Shawn Michaels in Canada that Vince's actions become unreasonable. Bret gave him plenty of options but Vince didn't take them.

True but Vince wanted the belt on Shawn and I don't think that is unreasonable even if the wrestlers hate each other. At the time I liked Bret better (still do), but he did take himself to seriously and if Shawn refused to drop the belt in the USA that is just being stupid.


It was the time of a big 4 and was the main event. Dropping the belt earlier negates the build to it, dropping it after leave it open for Bischoff to say "no one could beat Brett" and generally you want to give the new champion the rub of beating the old one regardless of who it is.

Brett should have dropped the belt to Shawn, its basically part of the job and he was on the way out so you generally lie down and stare at the lights is the expectation. Yeah sure Shawn was a jackass but Brett was being unprofessional.

 

[Jacob Fox]

True but Vince wanted the belt on Shawn and I don't think that is unreasonable even if the wrestlers hate each other. At the time I liked Bret better (still do), but he did take himself to seriously and if Shawn refused to drop the belt in the USA that is just being stupid.


It was the time of a big 4 and was the main event. Dropping the belt earlier negates the build to it, dropping it after leave it open for Bischoff to say "no one could beat Brett" and generally you want to give the new champion the rub of beating the old one regardless of who it is.

Brett should have dropped the belt to Shawn, its basically part of the job and he was on the way out so you generally lie down and stare at the lights is the expectation. Yeah sure Shawn was a jackass but Brett was being unprofessional.

It's not unreasonable if you consider everything that happened. The very fact that Bret Hart gave Vince McMahon several alternatives as to how to drop the belt, including to Shawn Michaels, shows that he was trying to work with Vince to figure something out. If Bret had simply said "I refuse to drop the belt to Shawn Michaels at all" or "I refuse to do anything except forfeit the belt," then you would have a point. But that's not what happened. He proposed several options.

This happening at one of the big four is actually not relevant. There have been plenty of times that a big four main event had been changed or has ended without being conclusive. Shawn Michaels actually has done it himself, forfeiting the belt because he "lost his smile" rather than face Bret at Wrestlemania 13 and drop the belt back to him. In fact, they could have taken advantage of the inconclusive ending that was planned for the Survivor Series and then had a rematch on Raw that would have probably had monster ratings.

And yeah, Bret should have just dropped the title to Shawn at Survivor Series. But I cannot agree in any way that he was being unprofessional. He tried over months to try and work something out with Vince in regards to his contract, including deferring money if the WWF couldn't completely afford it at the time. Vince, admittedly, was trying to get Bret to leave and go to WCW because the Clique and he had problems and he wanted to not have to pay Bret's contract. So Vince kept proposing things to Bret that Bret wasn't keen on to get him to leave. That's unprofessional.

Bret offered many scenarios in which he was willing to drop the belt. It wasn't like he was just not going to do it. He just didn't want to drop it to Shawn in Canada. And honestly, since Shawn "Lost his smile" and dropped the belt rather than facing Bret at Wrestlemania 13, I think Bret's request was quite reasonable.

 

[Zardnaar]

It's not unreasonable if you consider everything that happened. The very fact that Bret Hart gave Vince McMahon several alternatives as to how to drop the belt, including to Shawn Michaels, shows that he was trying to work with Vince to figure something out. If Bret had simply said "I refuse to drop the belt to Shawn Michaels at all" or "I refuse to do anything except forfeit the belt," then you would have a point. But that's not what happened. He proposed several options.

This happening at one of the big four is actually not relevant. There have been plenty of times that a big four main event had been changed or has ended without being conclusive. Shawn Michaels actually has done it himself, forfeiting the belt because he "lost his smile" rather than face Bret at Wrestlemania 13 and drop the belt back to him. In fact, they could have taken advantage of the inconclusive ending that was planned for the Survivor Series and then had a rematch on Raw that would have probably had monster ratings.

And yeah, Bret should have just dropped the title to Shawn at Survivor Series. But I cannot agree in any way that he was being unprofessional. He tried over months to try and work something out with Vince in regards to his contract, including deferring money if the WWF couldn't completely afford it at the time. Vince, admittedly, was trying to get Bret to leave and go to WCW because the Clique and he had problems and he wanted to not have to pay Bret's contract. So Vince kept proposing things to Bret that Bret wasn't keen on to get him to leave. That's unprofessional.

Bret offered many scenarios in which he was willing to drop the belt. It wasn't like he was just not going to do it. He just didn't want to drop it to Shawn in Canada. And honestly, since Shawn "Lost his smile" and dropped the belt rather than facing Bret at Wrestlemania 13, I think Bret's request was quite reasonable.

Context WWE was in the crapper with money in 97, hence why VInce wanted Brett gone. The money is Brett dropping the title at a big 4 event.

You don't want the inmates running the asylum. VInce is the boss, he is the promoter, and the screw job was not even his idea nor was it finalised until later on. Sure Vince did not handle it the best but I think he genuinely did not know what to do and the screw job was a last minute thing that was not VInce's idea (Shawn, HHH had the basic idea).

Vince should have got the belt of Bret earlier, there are a lot of things he did wrong but expecting Brett to drop it as SS is a fair call. He is the boss, its his company, he is the promoter.

 

[WrestleRacer91]

I feel if the screw job never happened (like Bret said in the past), the match would have ended in a no contest thus retaining the title. The following night, Bret would say "this isn't how I wanted to retain the title at Survivor Series. So tonight on Monday Night Raw how about we do it again? This time no screwy finishes, no disqualifications." HBK agrees and the match ends up being another cluster with HHH interfering. Owen comes down to help his brother as Raw goes off the air with no finish.

The next week (Nov. 17th and still in Canada) Bret gets put in a tag match with his brother Owen vs HBK and HHH which Bret and Owen win since HBK and HHH walk out of the match thus getting counted out.

Now it's Nov. 24th and the WWF is back in the United States (North Carolina). Shawn Michaels starts Monday Night Raw by coming out and saying "Now that we're in a real country, how about we settle this once and for all Bret Hart. The next PPV is quickly approaching and its called D-Generation X. Its called that for a reason Bret. And that reason is simple. D-Generation X is the best thing going today. So I don't know what you have going on but I know I want to end this. I want one more shot at the WWF title." Bret comes out and agrees to the match on one stipulation. HHH has to defend his European Championship against his brother Owen tonight with no interference whatsoever. If he even sees the shadow of Chyna or HBK anywhere near ringside then Shawn gets no title match. Shawn agrees. Triple H defends his European title against Owen in the main event of Raw and Owen Hart wins the title as Raw goes off the air.

The next week on Raw (Dec. 1st/Six days before In Your House: DX) Shawn comes out and says "Are you happy Bret? Your brother is European champion and Triple H is not." Bret comes out and tells Shawn to "shut the hell up. Nobody wants to hear what you have to say." Bret then asks Shawn "Are you happy? You get your damn match this Sunday. But you won't be happy at the end of the night. Because I will still be the WWF champion. Why? Because I'm the best there is, the best there was and the best there ever will be." This brings us to D-Generation X: In Your House which will be in my next post.
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So now we're at D-Generation X: In Your House which took place December 7th, 1997.

Here's a list of other matches in my fantasy WWF booking that takes place that night:

- Taka Michinoku defeated Brian Christopher to become the first WWF Light Heavyweight champion.

- Los Boricuas (with Savio Vega) defeated The Disciples of Apocalypse in a six man tag team match.

- The New Age Outlaws (Billy Gunn and Road Dogg) (c) defeated The Legion of Doom (Animal and Hawk) to retain the WWF World Tag Team championship.

- Ken Shamrock defeated The Undertaker by disqualification.

- Stone Cold Steve Austin (c) defeated The Rock to retain the WWF Intercontinental championship.

- Triple H (with Chyna) defeated Owen Hart (c) to become the WWF European champion.

- Bret Hart (c) defeated Shawn Michaels to retain the WWF championship.
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**NOTE**
I forgot HHH wasn't champion on the 24th of November thus my booking kind of already jumped the shark but lets just say HBK gave HHH the European title to challenge for the WWF title which Owen ended up winning at the end of the night anyway so it's not so bad.

Anywho, we're now on the road to the Royal Rumble. Over the next few weeks after losing to Bret at DX: In Your House, Shawn shifts his focus over to The Undertaker just like he did in real life. While Bret on the other hand shifts his focus on Ken Shamrock who beat Undertaker (by DQ) at DX: IYH.

Meanwhile Stone Cold is getting more and more popular each and every week as The Rock seems to be breaking away from The Nation of Domination.

The next PPV I want to highlight is the 1998 Royal Rumble. Stay tuned.
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Here's my fantasy booking of the Royal Rumble which took place on January 18th, 1998.

- The Rock defeated Faarooq by pinfall. (Now breaking up The Nation of Domination)

- The Legion of Doom (Animal and Hawk) defeated The New Age Outlaws (Billy Gunn and Road Dogg) (c) by disqualification.

- The Undertaker defeated Shawn Michaels (with Chyna and Triple H) in a Casket match. (Thus making HBK disappear for awhile)

- Bret Hart (c) defeated Ken Shamrock in 30 minute Iron Man match by a 2-1 fall.

- Stone Cole wins the 1998 Royal Rumble by last eliminating The Rock to earn the right to face the WWF champion at WrestleMania XV.

The next night on Raw, Stone Cold comes out and announces that seeing as he won the 1998 Royal Rumble he needs to focus on the WWF title and doesn't have time to defend his Intercontinental championship. He then calls out The Rock who was the last man eliminated in the Rumble. Offers him the championship as Rock accepts.

Austin then says he hopes Bret "the sh*tman" is still champion come WrestleMania because he has unfinished business with him.

Over the next few weeks buildup for WWF's next PPV called No Way Out of Texas: In Your House include The Rock vs Jeff Jarrett, D'Lo Brown & Mark Henry vs The New Age Outlaws and more. Stay tuned...
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Here's my card for No Way Out of Texas: In Your House that took place February 15th, 1998 in Houston, TX.

- The New Age Outlaws (Billy Gunn and Road Dogg) (c) defeated D'Lo Brown and Mark Henry to retain the WWF World Tag Team championships.

- Vader defeated Faarooq.

- The Rock (c) defeated Jeff Jarrett to retain the WWF Intercontinental championship.

- The Headbangers (Mosh and Thrasher) defeated The Godwinns (Henry O. and Phineas I. Godwinn).

- Cactus Jack and Chainsaw Charlie defeated Kane and The Undertaker.

- Stone Cold Steve Austin defeated Triple H.

- Bret Hart (c) defeated Ken Shamrock via submission to retain the WWF championship.

Next up is WrestleMania XIV. Stay tuned...
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So we finally made it to WrestleMania XIV which took place March 29th, 1998 in the FleetCenter in Boston, Massachusetts.

The original card had Stone Cold taking on Shawn Michaels in the main event but seeing as Shawn isn't WWF champion. He's actually gone for awhile since in my world, he lost a casket match against The Undertaker back in January at the Royal Rumble. Bret Hart is still in the WWF and he's the current champion. Stone Cold won the Rumble and is taking on Bret Hart. So without further adieu,may I present to you WWF WrestleMania XIV!

- Taka Michinoku (c) defeated Aguila to retain the WWF Light Heavyweight championship.

- Owen Hart defeated Triple H (with Chyna) (c) to become the new WWF European champion.

- Cactus Jack and Chainsaw Charlie defeated The New Age Outlaws (Billy Gunn and Road Dogg) (c) to become the new WWF World Tag Team champions.

- Ken Shamrock defeated The Rock (c) to become the new WWF Intercontinental champion.

- Marc Mero and Sable defeated Goldust and Luna Vachon.

- Jeff Jarrett defeated Vader.

- LOD 2000 (Hawk and Animal) defeated D'Lo Brown and Mark Henry.

- Kane defeated The Undertaker (with Paul Bearer).

- Stone Cold Steve Austin defeated Bret Hart (c) to become the new WWF Champion.