Robin Williams dead

[Defiant]

Because I should treat an idiot who decides that taking their own life is some kind of superior being and not the piece of shit dirtbag that they are. Explains Cobain ffs.

Good actor, piece of shit human being who proved to ultimately be a waste of space.

And before people go preaching about depression, I have suffered from it in the past, and guess what. its as simple as occupying the mind and preventing boredom. TV & videogames in moderation, be active, be social, get over it.

The most extreme post in this thread so far. I still don't understand the jump in logic from acknowledging Williams was a comedic talent whose life will be remembered for making the world a little happier... To "Well fuck him all along then, piece of shit idiot" for killing himself. Where does that easily sparked hatred come from, knowing of the man's legacy and work? Do you believe he just did it for attention or something?

Apart from your last paragraph which has some merit, everything else in your post is ridiculous. When I ask why people are saying he doesn't deserve our sympathy in light of his suicide, I am not trying to portray Williams as a "superior being" who did something noble in death. I'm wondering how the hell that negates his career in comedy and the years he spend making us laugh in our childhoods. "Waste of space"? What drivel.

I really do respect the fact that you found a way to deal with your own case of depression. I assume this was a long-term thing that affected you for years, rather than merely a phase that came and went. If that's the case and you know what their pain is like, then I don't get how little patience or sympathy you have for those who can't find that way out yet.

I get where the "Man up, deal with it" attitude comes from but I'm afraid it's not that easy for a lot of people. Modern research has shown there's simply more to it.

I'll end this post with a tiny bit of the article on William's suicide I put up earlier. The part that asks for more explanation from the "suicide is selfish" posters, since I doubt anyone read it:

But if someone is genuinely depressed and feels their life is worthless, seeing that others consider their feeling selfish can surely only emphasise their own self-loathing and bleakness? It suggests that people will hate them even in death.

Maybe you know some people who have “attempted” suicide purely for attention? Fair enough; a debatable conclusion, but even if you’re right, so what? Surely someone who succeeds at committing suicide is a genuine sufferer who deserves our sympathy?

Perhaps you feel that those expressing sorrow and sadness are wrong and you need to show them that you know better, no matter how upsetting they may find it? And this is unselfish behaviour how, exactly?

Another thought... By the same logic, couldn't some absolute prick be justified in telling the grieving family to get over it and man up? Because how selfish it would be for them to dwell on their lost loved one. Don't they know he's already gone and there's nothing they can do anymore? What about the poor African kids who have the real problems?

So maybe this weekend while people are enjoying their movie marathon and appreciate the talent we've lost, you can keep stewing in hatred.

 

[Kiffy Lube]

How is suicide not selfish?

 

[Defiant]

How is suicide not selfish?

How IS it?

 

[Kiffy Lube]

I didn't know a group of people decide whether your commit suicide or not. I thought it was a self-made decision. Whoa.

 

[Chris]

I still think it comes from people not understanding how one could think to kill themselves. I know in my case I can't fathom anything that would make me want to take my own life, and in that I can't understand at all why someone else could do it, and because I can't think of any logical reason for someone to take their own life no matter how fucked up it is, it leads me to think that there is something illogical about that person's brain.

This isn't always true, such as people committing suicide when they're in some fucked up shit with the law and think it would be preferable to jail. I understand their point of view and that's not a depression suicide at all. I believe this could be referred to as a cowards way out and I would not argue at all.

But in Williams's case, the guy was 63 and there's no way he was in any sort of normal state of mind to be able to take his own life. I'm not condoning his decision. It was a fucking stupid decision and he shouldn't have done it. No, he probably didn't think of the consequences because if he did he wouldn't have done it. And by consequences I don't mean the people he left grieving, because the main consequence of his action was him no longer living. If he would have really stopped (and been able to think clearly), and thought about what he was doing, I don't think he would have been able to go through with it.

Jesus you guys take everything to both extremes when there is a middle ground (or a 1/4 ground). You can hate the guy for committing suicide, but it does not tarnish anything he's done prior. Maybe I'm different because I can still watch Chris Benoit matches without associating it with what he did (which was a lot more than suicide), but it doesn't affect how I see him. I can watch any of his movies and will enjoy them just as much as I did before.

 

[Defiant]

I didn't know a group of people decide whether your commit suicide or not. I thought it was a self-made decision. Whoa.

...What?

I still think it comes from people not understanding how one could think to kill themselves. I know in my case I can't fathom anything that would make me want to take my own life, and in that I can't understand at all why someone else could do it, and because I can't think of any logical reason for someone to take their own life no matter how fucked up it is, it leads me to think that there is something illogical about that person's brain.

This isn't always true, such as people committing suicide when they're in some fucked up shit with the law and think it would be preferable to jail. I understand their point of view and that's not a depression suicide at all. I believe this could be referred to as a cowards way out and I would not argue at all.

But in Williams's case, the guy was 63 and there's no way he was in any sort of normal state of mind to be able to take his own life. I'm not condoning his decision. It was a fucking stupid decision and he shouldn't have done it. No, he probably didn't think of the consequences because if he did he wouldn't have done it. And by consequences I don't mean the people he left grieving, because the main consequence of his action was him no longer living. If he would have really stopped (and been able to think clearly), and thought about what he was doing, I don't think he would have been able to go through with it.

Another great post, good point about motivations for suicide not involving depression. If news happens to break later on that Williams committed suicide to avoid jail or debt, then I may reconsider my view of him as a person.

I'm starting to wonder if people here are confused that I'm defending suicide as a concept or promoting it as the sensible solution to depression. I'm saying that depression (actual clinical depression, not the way people exaggerate boredom or feeling unhappy about a specific failure) is a mental disease that affects many people (1/4 according to stats) and suicide often the outcome. That and a little more empathy for the sufferer and support for the shaken family.

We do not know what went on in his head or why he would choose suicide (like you said he probably wasn't in clear thought), but that's precisely why sensitivity is so important. You have to take on a supportive role when helping someone through depression, you have to be patient and listen to them. Finger pointing because you don't get it helps absolutely nothing.

 

[ThatGuyFromNukemHigh]

...What?


Another great post, good point about motivations for suicide not involving depression. If news happens to break later on that Williams committed suicide to avoid jail or debt, then I may reconsider my view of him as a person.

I'm starting to wonder if people here are confused that I'm defending suicide as a concept or promoting it as the sensible solution to depression. I'm saying that depression (actual clinical depression, not the way people exaggerate boredom or feeling unhappy about a specific failure) is a mental disease that affects many people (1/4 according to stats) and suicide often the outcome. That and a little more empathy for the sufferer and support for the shaken family.

We do not know what went on in his head or why he would choose suicide (like you said he probably wasn't in clear thought), but that's precisely why sensitivity is so important. You have to take on a supportive role when helping someone through depression, you have to be patient and listen to them. Finger pointing because you don't get it helps absolutely nothing.

Maybe this asshole should have thought about that himself. Why is it I have to think about his family and friends, and also his fans when discussing this shit, when he couldn't think about them at all. He willingly put all of those people in mourning, he may have even caused cases of depression to manifest from this shit, for all we know, it leads to more fucking suicides. But lets not talk bad about a selfish prick, lets treat him like some fucking martyr.

As to your earlier question, it was an 8 year struggle with depression before finding help that was valuable and not profitable(a psych who helps vs. a psych who prescribes). I assume these psychs are even rarer in America. All it took was planning to be more active(going out for a walk, seeing a film in theatres, hitting up a concert at a local pub, or even conventions) planning for events helped to take a lot of the down time away, then there is the social aspect, where I started talking to more people, even using the internet as a way to help break me out of my shell at the start. Depression is a side effect of boredom, overcome depression by eliminating boredom.

 

[Keith]

Always find it very sad when these sorts of threads turn this negative. I am in the camp of not being anti-Williams because of his choice to commit suicide for reasons already mentioned, such as he would have been in a complex frame of mind and all. But also, as with the tragic loss of Philip Seymour Hoffman it is not the place of total strangers to judge these people, if their loved ones can forgive them then so should we. But really the reason this thread should not be turning to this, is because at a time like this people should be celebrating the man's talent not focusing on the negatives.

 

[Chris]

His loved ones would probably be pretty insulted if someone called him selfish too, especially depending on how aware of what he was going through at the time they were.

Also, no one his calling him a martyr, but I don't see the point of calling him the worst human in the world either when this thread could have just been about the memories of his life and not his death.

And man those veterans that commit suicide every year from PTSD...why can't those pussies just man the fuck up?

 

[Deezy]

His loved ones would probably be pretty insulted if someone called him selfish too, especially depending on how aware of what he was going through at the time they were.

Also, no one his calling him a martyr, but I don't see the point of calling him the worst human in the world either when this thread could have just been about the memories of his life and not his death.

And man those veterans that commit suicide every year from PTSD...why can't those pussies just man the fuck up?

So we comparing seeing your brothers dying and seeing peoples limbs being blown off to an actor with depression? Seems to trivialize real shit like shellshock which makes you unable to get a job, live with your family, have a lenghty relationship to something manageable like clinical depression?

Take a pill, have a cry and man the fuck up.....Comparing War to some guy having the blues is just desperate.

 

[Chris]

So suicide is okay then? I wasn't aware that it was ever an option. It's not the same at all, and I do think it's more understandable that those guys commit it, but I was wondering if you guys also thought they were just being pussies.

 

[Deezy]

So suicide is okay then? I wasn't aware that it was ever an option. It's not the same at all, and I do think it's more understandable that those guys commit it, but I was wondering if you guys also thought they were just being pussies.

Did I ever say suicide was ok? Was not my whole emphasis on suicide was it not being an option?

Way to put words in my mouth.

 

[Chris]

Jesus, I asked a question "So suicide is okay then?" QUESTION MARK! I don't know what your thoughts are other than you think it's a cowards way out and I was wondering whether you also believed that to be the case with veterans.

 

[Deezy]

Jesus, I asked a question "So suicide is okay then?" QUESTION MARK! I don't know what your thoughts are other than you think it's a cowards way out and I was wondering whether you also believed that to be the case with veterans.

you honestly don't think my blanket statement doesn't apply to all? Those other veterans who don't kill themselves are far better men than the ones who do. Those NFL players with concussions too, anyone nwith a brain injury also.....Suicide is a cowards way out....You have a problem? Suck it up buttercup....a phrase I lived with and survived with.

 

[Chris]

And for the record, I don't care what anyone's thoughts on suicide are because it's a hot topic and there's bounds to be plenty of people that agree and disagree with me, but when suicide is such a big deal to you that you can't watch or enjoy any of his work from when he was alive, then I honestly think you have a personal problem of your own. Calling him a piece of shit and a waste of space is extreme...I can understand coward and pussy (really don't disagree with too much of what you're saying @deezy), but @ThatGuyFromNukemHigh you seem to be legitimately angry at this for some reason that I don't get.

He didn't murder anyone else besides himself, and none of us should be emotionally affected by it because I doubt we knew him personally. We don't need to question why he did it or anything because I don't think many of us really care too much do we? Can we not enjoy what he did when he was alive without putting a stigma on it?