"Workrates" and my issues with Raw

[Black Iron PJ]

One of my biggest pet-peeves as a wrestling fan is judging an entire wrestler based on their performance in the ring. I would say this is a small issue as I don’t see any of my friends who like wrestling talk about it, but I see it everywhere else in other wrestling forums, reddit, and youtube comments. I’m sorry but if you judge a wrestler purely on how they wrestle, well then you're the exact kind of person WWE makes fun of as the “internet fans”. Liking wrestling for one reason or the other is perfectly fine, I myself love wrestling for the theatrics. Finn Balor is mediocre on the mic? I don’t care because I get to see him enter as an ancient war demon with epic orchestral music playing. Katsuyori Shibata is too stiff and dangerous? So? Every time he enters the ring, he enters it like a fighter, like a real badass that doesn't need to be booked like one, but actually is one. But that doesn't mean I judge wrestlers based purely on that, it would be stupid to do so as not all wrestlers have badass entrances and that's fine. I just feel every wrestler is different and they should be judged differently. I don’t care about how well a guy can sell, I don’t care how many moves you can do seamlessly, I don’t watch wrestling for the fucking workrates, I watch it for the characters, and the storylines that tie into the wrestling.

This ties directly into my main reason why Raw is so insufferable to watch. It's because everyone wrestles too much, yeah that's a stupid thing to complain about in a WRESTLING show. But matches just go on for too long, there’s too many of them for me to get invested, and half of them are pure filler! Storylines are based on “Oh you said something mean to me in the locker room, let's fight!” That's not storylines, that's what you get for generating storylines for TEW. It makes guy like Cesaro look unspecial when his talent is pure wrestling, well when everyone from Kevin Owens to Titus O’Neil is wrestling at the same length as you are, it makes you look uneventful, what makes you stand out from everyone else. Don’t get me wrong, I love Cesaro, he’s one of my favorites, but they’re putting him in storyline where’s he’s not allowed to show his strengths, he and Sheamus are in a feud between Enzo and Cass, and while I like all 4 guys, the feud has been based on promo time which has always been Cesaro’s primary weakness. Well some of you may say “Oh he’s a midcarder, they need the special storylines for the main eventers.” Well that brings me to my next point, you know the phrase “You only appreciate something when it's gone”? That can applied in wrestling, remember how everybody was so looking forward to Seth Rollins grand return, even though the last two months of his title reigns were absolute shit and he was over-saturating Raw, but we missed him, missing him made us realise all the great things he did as world champion, made us realize that. You can still do that with wrestlers by not injuring them, there's about 5-6 main eventers on Raw that are full time, whats wrong with maybe backing out for a month or two to give them the ball to some of the midcarders stuck in hell like Sami Zayn. Putting Sami Zayn in a great storyline, a storyline that will allow him to show off his personality, develop it more and really make him connect with the crowd would make him a star. What doesn't make him a star is wrestling Kevin Owens every other week and always losing. If you could give Roman Reigns sixty different storylines that would sound great and engaging if it weren’t being handed to by Roman Reigns, you could at least give some guys one engaging and meaningful storyline for them to do.

Spoiler

@Jacob Fox There I did it

 

[Solid Snake]

One of the issues I tend to see done on Raw and in some cases, even SmackDown is that they don't book wrestlers to their strengths. If you have a solid guy on the mic and one who isn't so good yet, having them work together offsets the issue. The same can be said for in ring ability. I feel like the way they book these men and women shows their weaknesses and then it further worsens them with poor, lack luster, cluster clucked story lines that either make no sense, end too soon, or get rushed to the point where I can't even get invested. You add this on top of an already over loaded work schedule and what do you think is going to happen? They need to build HISTORY between these wrestlers so when they finally do face off, it is a HUGE deal.

Raw needs to be bumped down to 2 hours again (yes, I am saying it for the 1,234,631,324 time) and they need to rotate their wrestlers so they don't get stale. This will also improve story lines and even give these hard working men and women TIME OFF! They don't need to be off every other day but come on. And also, if you rotate them you allow some of them to improve off screen/show so when they do get a chance to be "THE GUY" (or GAL) they are prepared for it.

I don't know if any of that made sense. I kind of rambled. lol

 

[Grievous 3D]

I think the WWE forgets that a wrestler doesn't need to actually "wrestle" to make their presence felt and
make an impact...

Let's use the SmackDown Women's Division as an example...So...I believe that in the last couple of months
SmackDown had 2 shows (one before the Rumble...and I think one shortly after) where none of the ladies
wrestled a match. Instead we had interview segments, in-ring promos and some backstage fighting between
Nikki & Nattie. The point I'm making is that SmackDown have shown that it is possible to develop a feud and
push a wrestler without them wrestling a match every week.

Look at the Miz and Maryse...they haven't wrestled in 2 weeks...but they are active and getting TV time...
Baron Corbin is another one...his feud with Ambrose is developing without him wrestling matches...we
don't need Corbin in the ring wrestling pointless squash matches and they are keeping his interactions
with Ambrose short, sharp and violent...and then that way...when they eventually fight at Wrestlemania
(hopefully in a Street Fight) we will be excited to see them fight in an actual match...because we haven't
seen it every week.

Just look at the recent Roman Reigns/Kevin Owens feud...it seemed like every week they were having some
kind of match...or Owens was fighting Rollins....or Jericho was fighting Roman...it was a cycle of repetitive
madness...it got to the point where I just wanted Braun Strowman to crush them all so I didn't have to see
the same 4 guys wrestling each other every week.

Just because you have a wrestler...doesn't mean they have to wrestle...

RAW have a group of talented performers who could help fill their 3 hour run time and entertain everyone...
The Cruiserweight Division should be let off their "leash" and given more match time. Scale the top of the
card guys back and make them feel more special...Less is More...

 

[Stopspot]

There's too much wrestling in wrestling? Does not compute.

The best wrestlers don't need to speak because they can convey all they want said with their way of moving and working alone.

There's a reason the cruiserweight classic and the UK tournament are considered WWE's two best shows in recent time and I am pretty sure it is the wrestling.

Guys who are worse in ring should definitely not have as long matches as the guys who are good at that. But 9 times out of 10 WWE tends to get that right

 

[Snowman1]

A good wrestler can channel some aspects of their wrestling into making that character for them work. Like Cesaro... Many people respect Cesaro as a "great worker", but really... we remember several impressive spots as well as some devastating uppercuts and that's about it... Many times I find myself "pretty" underwhelmed by what actually happens in Cesaro matches, but he makes up for that by the fact that when he's doing it, he comes across as a total badass. When you show, there's no need to tell (to your other point about Cesaro). For a pure wrestling-based promotion, Neville being the greatest high-flier in the world who can innovate like nobody's business - while also mat wrestling and kicking you to fuck, beating you multiple ways - is a superstar from a pure sports perspective. Brock Lesnar basically built a character based off that aura (before it got very, very stale). New Day was at their best when they had their antics going during a wrestling match.

The other side of this is much of Bray Wyatt, who rambles on about all this bullshit in all these promos, but much of what got him in such a bad position is that when the bell rings, none of that mumbo-jumbo matters... and when it does Dean Ambrose is getting distracted by ghost lanterns.

Raw's biggest issue isn't too much talking or too much wrestling... it's too little of either one having a purpose. It's better to have a talking segment that develops a character than a filler match, but it's better to have a filler match than Stephanie doing anything, and that's where low standards kick in...

And to Stop's point... Mania 30, Mania 31. Good wrestling can make you forget about horrible buildups (and good story payoffs can make up for some truly toxic stories...) Even if some of the shine came off those shows in hindsight, at the time watching them it didn't feel as such...

 

[Black Iron PJ]

There's too much wrestling in wrestling? Does not compute.

The best wrestlers don't need to speak because they can convey all they want said with their way of moving and working alone.

There's a reason the cruiserweight classic and the UK tournament are considered WWE's two best shows in recent time and I am pretty sure it is the wrestling.

Guys who are worse in ring should definitely not have as long matches as the guys who are good at that. But 9 times out of 10 WWE tends to get that right

Yeah, the cruiserweight and the UK tournaments were fantastic because of the stories, characters, AND the wrestling. In the cruiserweight classic we had Brian Kenderick going for one final shot at glory by the winning the tournament and concluding with one of the most heartwarming scenes in wrestling with him and Bryan embracing each other after he lost, we had two tag team partners and best friends, Johnny Gargano and Tomasso Ciampa fighting each other in the first round. They were characters, different people from different backgrounds with different styles and each one of them were given their own video package to make them connect with the audience. The wrestling in the CWC was great, but what made it fantastic was all the storylines invovled, and how they made us care about the characters who were wrestling. If it was just pure, no interviews, no stories, no post match character interactions, wrestling then I don't care how good the wrestling is, it'll get boring after the fourth match because nothing worthwhile advances other than the tournament itself. You don't watch a musical for only the music, you watch it for the characters, the story, and the music.

I'm not asking for everyone to have a microphone and an entire audience to talk about their life story for 10 minutes, I'm asking for their to be good, nuancened, and engaging storylines, not one good storylines, but multiple ones, storylines that I may not personally care about but thats fine as I can get engaged in another, equally well-developed one.

 

[Stopspot]

Yeah, the cruiserweight and the UK tournaments were fantastic because of the stories, characters, AND the wrestling. In the cruiserweight classic we had Brian Kenderick going for one final shot at glory by the winning the tournament and concluding with one of the most heartwarming scenes in wrestling with him and Bryan embracing each other after he lost, we had two tag team partners and best friends, Johnny Gargano and Tomasso Ciampa fighting each other in the first round. They were characters, different people from different backgrounds with different styles and each one of them were given their own video package to make them connect with the audience. The wrestling in the CWC was great, but what made it fantastic was all the storylines invovled, and how they made us care about the characters who were wrestling. If it was just pure, no interviews, no stories, no post match character interactions, wrestling then I don't care how good the wrestling is, it'll get boring after the fourth match because nothing worthwhile advances other than the tournament itself. You don't watch a musical for only the music, you watch it for the characters, the story, and the music.

I'm not asking for everyone to have a microphone and an entire audience to talk about their life story for 10 minutes, I'm asking for their to be good, nuancened, and engaging storylines, not one good storylines, but multiple ones, storylines that I may not personally care about but thats fine as I can get engaged in another, equally well-developed one.

Wrestling does not negate character tho, in fact it enhances it. Wrestling is the key way that you get a character across. The CWC was as good as no promos. It was all kept to minimal video packages.

In wrestling, you tell the story through the wrestling. Whoever says otherwise is in the wrong business. Your wrestling is how you establish your character, your wrestling is how you tell your story.

The term workrate is also such a wide term in wrestling. It can mean your work on the mic, as a character or as a wrestler. Everyone's workrate takes shape differently. Obviously workrate is important.