Who are the best on-screen villains in history?

[seabs]

Roddy Piper.

 

[Stopspot]

For me, I'd say Nolan's Joker is without question the GOAT villain. He embodies raw evil in a way that no other movie villain does (that I know of.) Most villains have their goal or motivation, but the Joker is just evil, pure and simple. Add to this the thematic universality of chaos and anarchy, the relevance to the political climate at the time the movie was made, the imagery of the purple suit and the makeup, and fact that Ledger done a brilliant job acting him and Nolan done a brilliant job writing/directing him, and it's pretty difficult to consider any other villain even in the Joker's league. Jack Nicholson's Joker was great and truer to comics, but from a technical standpoint, he doesn't really compare to Nolan/Ledger's.

Good points. But wouldn't some kind of emotional investment help elevate him even more?

In my opinion the best villains are the ones that you can understand why they are villains. You see how in their minds they are justifying their actions. The joker is a great villain but there is no method to his madness (which is what draws a lot of people to him).

Just my thoughts from reading your post

 

[seabs]

Also the greatest portrayal of the Joker I've seen is John DiMaggio in Under The Red Hood, the voice work was incredible in that.

 

[Crayo]

They touched on the emotional side when Joker was telling stories regarding his scars. His father was an abusive drunk and his mother was one who constantly abandoned him and took the father's side. You can tell his childhood was the cause of the madness, but you don't always have to be so emotionally involved with a villain. I much prefer just knowing he had a fucked up past somehow which turned him into this crazy genius. The less you know the better in some cases.

 

[Stopspot]

It might just be me but I prefer characters were you can be a bit emotionally invested. Like Bane. We know why he is the way he is (born in a prison, forced to serve his father's sentence) you understand why he wants to watch the world burn. He has been wronged since birth and raised in society's dark side. Or Ra's Al Ghul who started off as an idealist out to save the world but who was corrupted by the darkness he was fighting and is now out to save it by destroying it.

I love the Joker character though.

 

[seabs]

 

[Stopspot]

Oooh I love that Joker. DiMaggio did him well.

 

[Crayo]

"They touched on the emotional side when Joker was telling stories regarding his scars. His father was an abusive drunk and his mother was one who constantly abandoned him and took the father's side. You can tell his childhood was the cause of the madness"

Joker doesn't warrant a sob-story. You're not really meant to feel sorry for The Joker as he connects with the audience in a much better way - sheer entertainment. Ask 100,000 Batman fans who their favourite villain from Nolan's sequal was, I guarantee over 80% will say Joker. Nolan wrote him perfectly in terms of having him connect with the audience, and was one of the biggest draws to that movie (if not the biggest).

 

[Crayo]

Just me who thinks that sucks? Sorry, but I dislike the voice, and that's all I can really connect to with something like that.

 

[Stopspot]

You're one of few Batman fans I have seen who isn't a fan of DiMaggio's Joker.

A vast majority of the fanbase from the Animated series have thrown their chips in with DiMaggio since Hammil retired from voicing Joker.

 

[Crayo]

Not sure why we're comparing animated Joker's to on-screen portrayals of them at all tbh. Compare DiMaggio with Hammil, not with Ledger or Jack.

 

[Laura]

Good points. But wouldn't some kind of emotional investment help elevate him even more?

In my opinion the best villains are the ones that you can understand why they are villains. You see how in their minds they are justifying their actions. The joker is a great villain but there is no method to his madness (which is what draws a lot of people to him).

Just my thoughts from reading your post

Actually, I think emotion would've only been detrimental to the Joker. The key to his epicness was the ambiguity. We don't know his name, we don't know his back story. He's not a man, he's a symbol - even more so than Batman. The worst thing they could've done would be to humanize him, IMO. If he was human, he wouldn't seem so strong, so infallible. It's that strength that makes him great. He's a villain that you truly believe might actually win in the end (and kind of does.)

 

[Crayo]

Actually, I think emotion would've only been detrimental to the Joker. The key to his epicness was the ambiguity. We don't know his name, we don't know his back story. He's not a man, he's a symbol - even more so than Batman. The worst thing they could've done would be to humanize him, IMO. If he was human, he wouldn't seem so strong, so infallible. It's that strength that makes him great. He's a villain that you truly believe might actually win in the end (and kind of does.)

Damn you know you're stuff. Another great post.

 

[Stopspot]

Actually, I think emotion would've only been detrimental to the Joker. The key to his epicness was the ambiguity. We don't know his name, we don't know his back story. He's not a man, he's a symbol - even more so than Batman. The worst thing they could've done would be to humanize him, IMO. If he was human, he wouldn't seem so strong, so infallible. It's that strength that makes him great. He's a villain that you truly believe might actually win in the end (and kind of does.)

The Joker has been humanized for a long time actually. Who he was before he was joker and what he did is well known in the comics and has in no ways been negative on the character.

But I'll agree that Nolan's interpretation and lack of emotional investment did make for some great reactions. Watching Dark Knight the first time he was a blast. But the second time around I was trying to look more into the character and what drives it (I tend to do that) and found that I had surprisingly little to go with with this joker. It makes him interesting but I would have liked some kind of knowledge of the catalyst that made him who he is.

 

[seabs]

Damn you know you're stuff. Another great post.

ity2: bolding makes quotes disappear.