Opinions on a part time champion

[Gav back in the championship]

if they had the same scheduale a full timer would have whilst holding the title it would be fine if not then no

 

[seabs]

His match with Cena at Wrestlemania, while he all knew it wouldn't be a classic in terms of in-ring quality, was even more average than expected. Just slow, long and boring. I don't get why people hate his Rumble and (especially) Elimination Chamber matches with Punk, though. Rumble was pretty good and EC was great, in my opinion.

Just throwing it out there but his rumble one was basically him lying down holding his ribs as Punk hit him, it was incredibly slow IMO especially with Punk the standard is always high due to his previous work, with Cena I expected a meh match but I expected Punk / Rock to be a good back and forth match, especially with Rock looking slimmer.

The EC match was an improvement but really didn't entertain me the way Punk / Cena did for example, it wasn't Punk / Ryback bad (me vs you would have probably been better than that) but it still wasn't Punk standard for me.

Just my 2 pence (F your cents 'Murica :finger: )

 

[Dat Kid1]

Just throwing it out there but his rumble one was basically him lying down holding his ribs as Punk hit him, it was incredibly slow IMO especially with Punk the standard is always high due to his previous work, with Cena I expected a meh match but I expected Punk / Rock to be a good back and forth match, especially with Rock looking slimmer.

The EC match was an improvement but really didn't entertain me the way Punk / Cena did for example, it wasn't Punk / Ryback bad (me vs you would have probably been better than that) but it still wasn't Punk standard for me.

Just my 2 pence (F your cents 'Murica :finger: )

In terms of wrestling EC wasn't an amazing match but the storytelling in that match was great. It was similar to Taker/HHH at last year's mania where it wasn't the best thing we've ever seen, but the way it was presented was enough for it to be great. Not every match has to be a display of great technical prowess.

Just my 2 cents (F your pence Eurofags )

 

[seabs]

In terms of wrestling EC wasn't an amazing match but the storytelling in that match was great. It was similar to Taker/HHH at last year's mania where it wasn't the best thing we've ever seen, but the way it was presented was enough for it to be great. Not every match has to be a display of great technical prowess.

Just my 2 cents (F your pence Eurofags )

I wasn't even that keen on the story tbh (I'm a huge fag about story telling in wrestling and that one didn't seem to have it, a powerful tool could have been more Heyman interference but even he wasn't that involved. Plus The Rock getting disqualified gimmick was basically annoyed (A dusty finish should have been used here IMO although that would have been over kill with the rumble moment admittedly, although they did it twice to Benoit at Fully Loaded and Unforgiven 2000. The finish was this " Benoit continued to attack Rock until Rock brought a chair into the ring to attack Benoit but dropped it. However, McMahon brought another chair into the ring and hit the referee with it. Rock mocked Benoit by applying The Cripler Crossface and Benoit tapped out to the hold. However, as the referee recovered, he disqualified Rock because he did not see McMahon hitting him with the chair. As a result, Benoit won the title but the WWF Commissioner Mick Foley came out and restarted the match. Rock and Benoit continued to battle each other until Rock performed a Rock Bottom to win the match and thus retained the WWF Championship.[1][2]" from Wiki so running something similar to that would have told a stronger story for me.

 

[Lockard 23]

Maybe I thought the Rumble match was better than it really was because it wasn't painfully slow and boring like the Cena match at WM was. It didn't bore me anyway and I was into it so that was enough for me. Don't get why people would complain about the EC match, especially the last five or six minutes.

 

[Dat Kid1]

I wasn't even that keen on the story tbh (I'm a huge f#!g about story telling in wrestling and that one didn't seem to have it, a powerful tool could have been more Heyman interference but even he wasn't that involved. Plus The Rock getting disqualified gimmick was basically annoyed (A dusty finish should have been used here IMO although that would have been over kill with the rumble moment admittedly, although they did it twice to Benoit at Fully Loaded and Unforgiven 2000. The finish was this " Benoit continued to attack Rock until Rock brought a chair into the ring to attack Benoit but dropped it. However, McMahon brought another chair into the ring and hit the referee with it. Rock mocked Benoit by applying The Cripler Crossface and Benoit tapped out to the hold. However, as the referee recovered, he disqualified Rock because he did not see McMahon hitting him with the chair. As a result, Benoit won the title but the WWF Commissioner Mick Foley came out and restarted the match. Rock and Benoit continued to battle each other until Rock performed a Rock Bottom to win the match and thus retained the WWF Championship.[1][2]" from Wiki so running something similar to that would have told a stronger story for me.

Running interference in that match would have been just stale at that point. Shield had already done that in the last match between the two and you can see that Punk had been slowly drifting away from Heyman. On top of that there would then have to be another match where Rock wins the title back from Punk.

I think the story that they told with EC match was great, with the back and forth between the two, finisher after finisher. I think there was even a point where Punk had Rock down for the pin emphasizing that Punk could have beat Rock rather than saying Punk needed some sort aid to do it, which helps with his current character transition as to being someone who doesn't need help.

 

[seabs]

Running interference in that match would have been just stale at that point. Shield had already done that in the last match between the two and you can see that Punk had been slowly drifting away from Heyman. On top of that there would then have to be another match where Rock wins the title back from Punk.

I think the story that they told with EC match was great, with the back and forth between the two, finisher after finisher. I think there was even a point where Punk had Rock down for the pin emphasizing that Punk could have beat Rock rather than saying Punk needed some sort aid to do it, which helps with his current character transition as to being someone who doesn't need help.

Rock would have won... hence the dusty finish, in the referenced story Punk was Benoit and Rock was well Rock. It would have given Punk even more to complain about, not only did he have The Rock out twice but he also beat him twice, weakening the point someone made earlier about him returning and beating the two top guys in the E after a 10 year absence.

 

[Danielson]

I'm a Rock fan, and i've touched on this many times. It doesn't bother me that he will miss a few raws. It helps develop the Brock Lesnar story on Raws in which he is gone. I guess it would have been cool for the Rock to come out after the Punk Vs Cena bout, and had a face off. It would also be nice if he came in via sattellite and cut a promo for the two raws he will miss after this next monday, but I mean we know A LOT! We know what's going to happen, Cena wins. It's all about Cena anyways imo. I don't even mind Cena, and I don't see a problem with Rock being champion until he wins the title. I don't mind him missing a few raws because he will ultimately lose the thing. It's also a very entertaining feud imo, which is setting up for a final battle down the line. I hope a lot of you can try to enjoy what is happening here, because in 10 years it will go down as one of the better fueds in wwe history.

 

[Dat Kid1]

Rock would have won... hence the dusty finish, in the referenced story Punk was Benoit and Rock was well Rock. It would have given Punk even more to complain about, not only did he have The Rock out twice but he also beat him twice, weakening the point someone made earlier about him returning and beating the two top guys in the E after a 10 year absence.

Regardless something was already done similar to that at the previous PPV and it would just be stale if it was done again. Punk can already say that he had the Rock out because he actually had him down for more than a 3 count at EC, but there was no referee.

 

[seabs]

Regardless something was already done similar to that at the previous PPV and it would just be stale if it was done again. Punk can already say that he had the Rock out because he actually had him down for more than a 3 count at EC, but there was no referee.

Not sure if even read my post, it isn't stale as it's a completely different false finish and it's a replication of the benoit moments in 2000,which wasn't stale plus the Heyman influence was horribly neglected, why add the stipulation in if you're not going to use it, it's irrational booking in a similar way the shield one was at the rumble. Why would Punk and Heyman add it unless there was a plan?

 

[Dat Kid1]

Not sure if even read my post, it isn't stale as it's a completely different false finish and it's a replication of the benoit moments in 2000,which wasn't stale plus the Heyman influence was horribly neglected, why add the stipulation in if you're not going to use it, it's irrational booking in a similar way the shield one was at the rumble. Why would Punk and Heyman add it unless there was a plan?

First off "Not sure if even read my post", really unnecessary.

I stated that it is similar to when McMahon came out during the Rumble and restarting the match, which would make him the Foley of the replication...again. Prior to EC Punk started distancing himself from Heyman as his involvement with the Shield was revealed as well as him being semi responsible for McMahon being injured.

The stipulation was just added to add more angst to that match, making it seem like Rock had more of a chance to lose which would make people actually want to see a rematch (PPV buys). On a side note I believe Punk mentioned Rock bumping into an official and saying that should have ended the match in a DQ, but then moved on to say that Rock beat him instead of repeating the "I was screwed angle from RR".

 

[seabs]

First off "Not sure if even read my post", really unnecessary.

No it isn't you're making points which were addressed in the posts, you're asking questions which I've already answered lol.

I stated that it is similar to when McMahon came out during the Rumble and restarting the match, which would make him the Foley of the replication...again. Prior to EC Punk started distancing himself from Heyman as his involvement with the Shield was revealed as well as him being semi responsible for McMahon being injured.

You mean by them hugging on one of the Raw's prior or how Paul saved Punk from the people's elbow? They were on the verge of breaking sure but Paul was still trying to maintain the alliance, both of them were. If they were breaking why even have Paul come out with him, if he's there you should use him. Why have Paul there and not use him, it's illogical. It is similar in that sense but the attack is completely different, an illogical choice would be The Shield attacking again as that was replication, seriously watch The Fully Loaded and Unforgiven matches and you'll see it wasn't a stale concept.

The stipulation was just added to add more angst to that match, making it seem like Rock had more of a chance to lose which would make people actually want to see a rematch (PPV buys). On a side note I believe Punk mentioned Rock bumping into an official and saying that should have ended the match in a DQ, but then moved on to say that Rock beat him instead of repeating the "I was screwed angle from RR".

So you're adding the stip purely for the build? What's the pay off? There isn't one, also Rock potentially losing wouldn't have encouraged any more buys, people pay to see Rock, not pay to see him lose (if he were a heel this would be logical but it isn't.)

So Punk mentioned it, why not build on that further? Say he had him beat via the DQ this caused Vickie to come out and re-start the match (she has tension with Heyman which once again had no pay off, this was a prime opportunity for some there but there wasn't.) after the interference by Heyman, Punk has beaten The Rock twice but has authority going against him causing the match to be restarted then he goes into this angle with a bit more credibility than he has currently as he had the result of beating The Rock twice only for it to be over turned (no one will remember the false count but having it over turned is a more memorable result) this stops the issue with Rock coming in after 2 matches in 2 years and an 8 year hiatus before that and ending the longest reign of the past what, 10 years without much objection.

 

[seabs]

You've gotta appreciate we seem to be in a circle here also, lol.

 

[Dat Kid1]

You mean by them hugging on one of the Raw's prior or how Paul saved Punk from the people's elbow? They were on the verge of breaking sure but Paul was still trying to maintain the alliance, both of them were. If they were breaking why even have Paul come out with him, if he's there you should use him. Why have Paul there and not use him, it's illogical. It is similar in that sense but the attack is completely different, an illogical choice would be The Shield attacking again as that was replication, seriously watch The Fully Loaded and Unforgiven matches and you'll see it wasn't a stale concept.

I've already seen those matches. I'm saying that having someone come out twice in a row to restart the match is stale. Something that would have been unique would be Paul attacking Punk and causing Rock to be disqualified, putting the title on Punk and having him walk away, but that wouldn't fit.

Paul Heyman was used during the match when he handed Punk the title to hit Rock with it.

So you're adding the stip purely for the build? What's the pay off? There isn't one, also Rock potentially losing wouldn't have encouraged any more buys, people pay to see Rock, not pay to see him lose (if he were a heel this would be logical but it isn't.)

Adding the stipulation positions Rock more as the underdog in the match. People don't pay to see him lose, or at least not many. However they would pay to see him come out of a situation that makes it seem impossible for him to come out of, which was the benefit of the stipulation.

So Punk mentioned it, why not build on that further? Say he had him beat via the DQ this caused Vickie to come out and re-start the match (she has tension with Heyman which once again had no pay off, this was a prime opportunity for some there but there wasn't.) after the interference by Heyman, Punk has beaten The Rock twice but has authority going against him causing the match to be restarted then he goes into this angle with a bit more credibility than he has currently as he had the result of beating The Rock twice only for it to be over turned (no one will remember the false count but having it over turned is a more memorable result) this stops the issue with Rock coming in after 2 matches in 2 years and an 8 year hiatus before that and ending the longest reign of the past what, 10 years without much objection.

Him building on it further would have just had the same result, with him going one on one with Cena for that shot, I can't see how it would have changed things. There is tension with Heyman, but not enough since she did resign Lesnar who is Heyman's client. The count IMO was one of the highest moments of the match, it emphasized that Punk has the ability to beat Rock. It was a great in ring storytelling moment. I think the RR match ended that speculation of whether or not Rock had the ability, because he was slammed through a table and still came back to beat Punk.

Not really important at all but Rock had 3 matches, his tag match being the 1st.

@Seabs

 

[Dat Kid1]

You've gotta appreciate we seem to be in a circle here also, lol.

We always are :haha: