Fantasy Basketball

[PHX]

You can place many PGs on a team with Amare, J-rich, and Grant Hill and make the playoffs. Lets be real, they have never truly contended (made the finals) with Nash at the helm so it isn't like a Jason Kidd can't do what he has done but better (see Jersey) and for less.

* I used Kidd because Nash had an opt out the same year he was a free agent a couple of seasons ago.

I didn't realize basketball was a one man sport. It's not his fault that they haven't won a title it's the team as a whole. I get you got some kind of thing against the man cause you didn't think he should have 2 mvp's cause Kobe only got one or w/e but fact of the matter it isn't like the man hasn't been doing his job and hasn't been any clear instance where u can point at the guy and say him doing such and such is why the Suns haven't won a title. It has been the team not making stops when they should and things of that nature.

 

[SAIYANS]

Stop. Seriously. Stop. Stop. Stop posting. Stop. You're making things up now. Stop.

Contender means you compete for a championship. Phoenix has never done that, so no they are not and have not been contenders. All they have ever been is a pretender and playoff fodder.

You can't honestly say that they haven't gave Nash enough talent in Phoenix to make the finals, can you?

He is the only MVP (2 time to boot) in league history to never make the big dance for fucks sake, so that is on him and not Phoenix when they have paid the luxury tax, instituted a system that maximizes him, hired the best medical staff in the league, and kept two perennial all star players around him for the majority of his stay.

 

[SAL]

You can place many SG/SFs on a team with Bynum, Odom, and Derek Fisher and make the playoffs. Lets be real, they have never truly contended (made the finals) with Kobe at the helm so it isn't like a LeBron James can't do what he has done but better and for less.

This is a good point, PSYCH.

 

[SAL]

Contender means you compete for a championship. Phoenix has never done that, so no they are not and have not been contenders. All they have ever been is a pretender and playoff fodder.

You can't honestly say that they haven't gave Nash enough talent in Phoenix to make the finals, can you?

He is the only MVP (2 time to boot) in league history to never make the big dance for fucks sake, so that is on him and not Phoenix when they have paid the luxury tax, instituted a system that maximizes him, hired the best medical staff in the league, and kept two perennial all star players around him for the majority of his stay.

He made the Conference Finals 3 times, and he could well have made the Finals last year if not for your lucky buzzer-beating bullshit. But still, bears repeating, he made the Conference Finals 3 times. In the far superior conference. He was close to a title on numerous occasions. Stop with this semantic "contending" horseshit.

 

[SAIYANS]

I just can't get over the fact that you think the Lakers front office is this group of Mother Teresas. No other team has former players on their staff after they retire! No other team plays max salaries to players who might not deserve it! Hell, Isiah Thomas was the most respectful figure in NBA history by your metrics.

I never said most respectful. I used them as an example as it does matter.

The reason T-Mac in the 00s wouldn't look at the Bulls was because of them (Reinord spelling?) treating MJ/Phil/Scottie poorly. The reason guys wouldn't look at the Knicks for years was because of how they did Ewing.

Other guys pay attention to how players are treated by franchises. Not every player deserves that type of treatment, but when you have guys that help you win and put in years of service (and get you profits) you are a damn fool to not take care of them to a reasonable extent.

Not being willing to guarantee a guys deal when it is protected by insurance under the CBA, waiving his bird rights thus limiting his chance to get more years and more money elsewhere while also getting something back for your franchise, and then going out and signing 4 role players to a greater amount of salary is a slap in the face.

 

[PHX]

Contender means you compete for a championship. Phoenix has never done that, so no they are not and have not been contenders. All they have ever been is a pretender and playoff fodder.

You can't honestly say that they haven't gave Nash enough talent in Phoenix to make the finals, can you?

He is the only MVP (2 time to boot) in league history to never make the big dance for fucks sake, so that is on him and not Phoenix when they have paid the luxury tax, instituted a system that maximizes him, hired the best medical staff in the league, and kept two perennial all star players around him for the majority of his stay.

Did I ever say he never had the talent? No what I said was the TEAM didn't do the extra things they needed to do to get over the top. One guy doesn't play defense by himself. When your only true good big man wasn't that good on D to help defend some of the top big's you'll see in the west come playoff time that plays a part in it. Yes Nash has the label of being a two time MVP to not win a title but again it's a team game and don't see what is so hard to understand that the team failed not just Nash. You're acting like the man has gone 0-20 shooting in playoff games, and has given up on his team.

 

[Phenomenal1]

You can't be that stupid, PSYCH.

 

[PHX]

He made the Conference Finals 3 times, and he could well have made the Finals last year if not for your lucky buzzer-beating bullshit. But still, bears repeating, he made the Conference Finals 3 times. In the far superior conference. He was close to a title on numerous occasions. Stop with this semantic "contending" horseshit.

This. this and this. Thank you.

 

[SAL]

While I'm arguing against PSYCH's nonsense, I feel I should put it out there that I don't think Nash deserved either MVP. He's never been a good defensive player, and part of what hurt the reputation of big men in Phoenix was that any competent PG could get around Nash at will and force them to help. The same thing Dwight Howard was (rightly) bitching about this year before Carter and Rashard got sent out.

 

[PHX]

While I'm arguing against PSYCH's nonsense, I feel I should put it out there that I don't think Nash deserved either MVP. He's never been a good defensive player, and part of what hurt the reputation of big men in Phoenix was that any competent PG could get around Nash at will and force them to help. The same thing Dwight Howard was (rightly) bitching about this year before Carter and Rashard got sent out.

Like I said while I'm against this whole "It's your fault Nash that Phoenix didn't win a title" but yes he was part of my point about getting stops on defense when they were needed. He sucks on defense but my point was he wasn't the only one who sucked on defense in all these years. And as far as big men in Phoenix in a nutshell they have all been pretty much trash, old, or okay.

 

[Phenomenal1]

Just a update that nobody cares about but I find quite funny.

Rudy and Pietrus have almost the exact same numbers so it wouldn't have mattered which I put on the bench. Only differences are Pietrus took 1 more 3 and Rudy had 2 TOs.

 

[SAIYANS]

He made the Conference Finals 3 times, and he could well have made the Finals last year if not for your lucky buzzer-beating bullshit. But still, bears repeating, he made the Conference Finals 3 times. In the far superior conference. He was close to a title on numerous occasions. Stop with this semantic "contending" horseshit.

He also under produced versus LA, San Antonio, and Dallas in those very times that he made said conference finals while allowing his counterparts in Fisher, Parker, and Terry to up their very averages against him.

There is no prize for not getting out your own damn conference when a team gives you talent and pays to make a run. LA paid the bill and got Kobe 1 guy who made the all star team once in his career and he got to the title back to back years and won with the youngest team in the history of the league. New Jersey paid the bill and Kidd took a lottery team along with Jefferson and K-Mart to back to back Finals. Cuban paid for Stackhouse, Terry, Dampier, and those guys to go alongside Dirk and he got them to the Finals. Miami paid for Shaq, Walker, Williams, and Posey so Wade did his damn job and won. LeBron wanted Hughes, Marshall, and Jones by his own admission to the Cavs overpaid to get them, but Lebron kept up his end of the deal and made the finals. The Spurs have paid time and time again for guys around Duncan and he got there. Boston paid for KG and Ray to join Paul and Paul delivered. Orlando played that ludicrous amount of money for Lewis, Alston, Nelson, and those guys to play alongside Dwight but he got to the Finals with them and made that bill well worth paying.

Nash did not keep up his end of the deal as management did their job (early in his stay). The difference between him and those other guys above is that when given talent, they found a way to win and carry their team to the Finals. NAsh didn't, so that is on him point blank.

 

[PHX]

Just a update that nobody cares about but I find quite funny.

Rudy and Pietrus have almost the exact same numbers so it wouldn't have mattered which I put on the bench. Only differences are Pietrus took 1 more 3 and Rudy had 2 TOs.

Yeah Pietrus has been quiet invisible in this game after having some impact in the past games.

 

[SAL]

How have you gone from "Phoenix ownership sucks" to "Steve Nash is a smurf who doesn't deserve a legacy" in one conversation? How many defense mechanisms are kicking in for you at the same time right now?

 

[SAIYANS]

Their ownership does suck for dicking around Amare how they did. Nash is just a contributing factor to said ownership having a reason to suck, they know that they won't be rewarded if they foot the bill for him because of his past so they can excuse or rationalize their moves. It is a catch 22 and in all honesty is why they just need to blow it up and rebuild; if they wait too long they will just be the Kings of the modern era.