Hometown Kid
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The Overrated Thread!!!!
- Thread starter He who knows more than Nation
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What I said is the truth, except the GOAT, that's strictly matter of opinion, but I can back it up. I'd put Big in the conversation as well, but if your calling me stupid for calling Rakim and Nas GOATS, then I'd imagine you don't know what you're talking about or have never listened to Rakim or don't realize rap didn't start in the 90's. He's the guy who took rap to the next level, changing the rhyme style from early 80's Grandmaster Flash- Run DMC style to the straight delivery flow. Paid in Full is one of the greatest rap albums ever, that shit made Rakim the rapper so many of the next generation modeled themselves after, he's like the HBK or Flair of his era, a true pioneer who's methods still hold up or exceed the industry standard to this day. Not to mention so so many places have dubbed him the GOAT including many of his peers.
And then there's Nasty Nas...fuck... Illmatic > than any Pac album, ever. Shit, Illmatic is easily top three material, plus It Was Written is sickness, as is God's Son. Actually the only poor album Nas put out was Nastradomus and that was still better than 85% of any rapper's best product.
LLCJ is a matter of opinion. I grew up on the guy and he was able to change with the times throughout his career. He sold shitloads of albums and carried the industry from the late 80's to the early 90s. That's the only thing you can even remotely call me out on and that's debatable.
I'd put Big, Emenim and Jay Z also in the convo, Pac is probably top 10, but bottom half, out of the convo. Why would you discount Nas and Rakim? Who would you put over them? And why?
re: Pac
While they were alive Big outsold Pac 4:1. That's a fucking rape in the most epic of proportions. Pac was smart as fuck, he knew how to sell more records, create controversy. I don't think he was as thugged out as his manufactured image made him appear to be. Dude had a small time criminal record, and was more scholar than thug. The man studied ballet and theatre. He performed in Shakespeare. Yah, that's real thug. C'mon, if the hatred were that deep he'd have shot Big or at very least jumped him, but all he did was trash him through rap. Why? Because he used a convenient story to make a great fucking beef to up his sales at the expense of the no.1 seller on the block. C'mon, that's the same shit people have been doing since then, he was just so smart he realized how to generate buzz for himself at the expense of another, someone higher up on the pecking order than himself. That's cheap heat, guvna. Tell me how you see it. Tell me what makes me dumb for calling it like I see it. Trying to get over at the expense of someone else is cheap. He did. Then he died and had the greatest successes of his career. Tupac is more myth than legend and that's why he is slightly over rated to me.
Not that your opinion is the end all be all of rap, but let me see how you call it.
^ It was the LL Cool J comment that made me say it.
As for Rakim, HBK is abit of stretch comparing since Rakim kinda disappeared after The Master and became more Bret Hart recently with that dud of an album, Seventh Seal. It's the legend of Pac that people will still put him over alot of artists when there's Big Daddy Kane staring right at you.
I consider Rakim a pioneer and all but I liked BDK more.
As for Rakim, HBK is abit of stretch comparing since Rakim kinda disappeared after The Master and became more Bret Hart recently with that dud of an album, Seventh Seal. It's the legend of Pac that people will still put him over alot of artists when there's Big Daddy Kane staring right at you.
I consider Rakim a pioneer and all but I liked BDK more.
Kane fell off alot sooner than Rakim... to my preference I prefer Kool G Rap over Kane as far as Juice Crew goes. Juice Crew was sickness.
Why do you think LL is whack? He had as much banger shit as he did lover shit. 14 Shots to the Dome and Phenomenon were ill fuckin albums and LL could murder a track as much as anyone from New York.
Why do you think LL is whack? He had as much banger shit as he did lover shit. 14 Shots to the Dome and Phenomenon were ill fuckin albums and LL could murder a track as much as anyone from New York.
seX-Power
Guest
If this is true then I will sadface.
And NinoBrown's shitty gifs keep slowing my page down.
Kizza
Guest
Why must it be just on this site? I've seen plenty of occasions elsewhere saying that Michelle is incredible, amazingly talented, looks beautiful etc etc.
straight_edge76
Guest
Ok, I am going to add my two cents into the Nino/Enzo debate.
When it comes to being the Greatest of All Time endless debates are going to be sparked. Personally I do consider 2pac one of, if not the best rappers of all time. Now that is not saying guys like B.I.G, Nas, Rakim, LL and everybody else you all named are not also legends in their own right. Sure 2pac may not have been the most 'Gangsta' of the Gangsta rappers but he added an element into hip-hip that was imo not used all that often, emotion. You could feel what he felt as he wrote each song, with 'Hit 'Em Up' you could almost feel the animosity he felty for not only Bad Boy and B.I.G but with the East Coast in general.
Nas, B.I.G and LL are all dope as well. Just in different ways. I dare anybody to say that 'Illmatic' and 'Ready to Die' aren't two of the greatest rap albums ever released. The only bad thing that I can say about Nas is that I do not think he had the mainstream success that guys like B.I.G, 2pac, Eminem and Jay-Z had. It's not necessarily due to lack of skill because he is one of if not the best lyricists to ever step up to the microphone. He just doesn't have that 'MTV factor' that some lesser MC's have.
LL I have always been a huge fan of. Many people knock him for going a more poppy route his last few albums but, let's face it like last 5-10 years he didn't need to be making music, his movies and older music were more then enough to feed himself and his family. He did it for the pure love of the music. He was also if I am not mistaken one of the first mainstream battle rappers along with Kool Moe Dee and KRS-One.
Rakim, he is a legend and a pioneer no doubt. He is dope I just personally don't listen to him all that much. But 'Paid in Full' was and still will be one of the most groundbreaking albums in hip-hop history.
A few more names I think can be put into the conversation are Ice Cube, DMX and Wu Tang. Wu Tang isn't a single artists and more a crew but you cannot deny that Method Man, Raekwon, Ghostface and company are not some of the illest craziest lyricists.
When it comes to being the Greatest of All Time endless debates are going to be sparked. Personally I do consider 2pac one of, if not the best rappers of all time. Now that is not saying guys like B.I.G, Nas, Rakim, LL and everybody else you all named are not also legends in their own right. Sure 2pac may not have been the most 'Gangsta' of the Gangsta rappers but he added an element into hip-hip that was imo not used all that often, emotion. You could feel what he felt as he wrote each song, with 'Hit 'Em Up' you could almost feel the animosity he felty for not only Bad Boy and B.I.G but with the East Coast in general.
Nas, B.I.G and LL are all dope as well. Just in different ways. I dare anybody to say that 'Illmatic' and 'Ready to Die' aren't two of the greatest rap albums ever released. The only bad thing that I can say about Nas is that I do not think he had the mainstream success that guys like B.I.G, 2pac, Eminem and Jay-Z had. It's not necessarily due to lack of skill because he is one of if not the best lyricists to ever step up to the microphone. He just doesn't have that 'MTV factor' that some lesser MC's have.
LL I have always been a huge fan of. Many people knock him for going a more poppy route his last few albums but, let's face it like last 5-10 years he didn't need to be making music, his movies and older music were more then enough to feed himself and his family. He did it for the pure love of the music. He was also if I am not mistaken one of the first mainstream battle rappers along with Kool Moe Dee and KRS-One.
Rakim, he is a legend and a pioneer no doubt. He is dope I just personally don't listen to him all that much. But 'Paid in Full' was and still will be one of the most groundbreaking albums in hip-hop history.
A few more names I think can be put into the conversation are Ice Cube, DMX and Wu Tang. Wu Tang isn't a single artists and more a crew but you cannot deny that Method Man, Raekwon, Ghostface and company are not some of the illest craziest lyricists.
^^^ That's why Wu-Tang is the greatest rap group ever and it's not even debatable. The only groups that come close would be De La Soul, NWA and A Tribe Called Quest and even then I'd only put Tribe really close to them.
straight_edge76
Guest
Yeah dude, Wu Tang is imo the best rap group ever. My favorite thingh about them was honestly how well they all meshed together. There are dozens of rap groups that have one or more than one dope MC but they just sound awkward, or not as fluid as Wu Tang as well as the other groups you mentioned (however I have not listened to much De La Soul).
MizMasta3000
Guest
You think of Wu Tang, all people give credit to is RZA, Method Man, Ghostface/Raekwon, and ODB. Insectah Deck, GZA, Masta Killa, and U-God get no love 
straight_edge76
Guest
Mainly because those are the only ones who really had some mainstream appeal/success. Personally they all are equally dope, but Method Man is personally my favorite member or Wu Tang.
MizMasta3000
Guest
You think of Wu Tang, all people give credit to is RZA, Method Man, Ghostface/Raekwon, and ODB. Insectah Deck, GZA, Masta Killa, and U-God get no love
LOL nobody likes U-God. He's like X-Pac of the group.
About LL, his earlier stuff was sooo much better. After Shots to Dome, he lost it. He lost the hard stuff, started catering to the ladies even though some of the tracks were good (Luv U Better), he lost the old fans.
@SeX-Power, that's your browser faults.
Wu Tang is a tad bit overrated but still the best group. 36 Chambers and W Forever was pretty much it, last three were pretty forgettable and what no love for Run DMC? RUN DMC > De La Soul (if were talking about impact)
You think of Wu Tang, all people give credit to is RZA, Method Man, Ghostface/Raekwon, and ODB. Insectah Deck, GZA, Masta Killa, and U-God get no love
GZA gets lots of love. U-God is easily the weak link in Wu. When they made the past album in 08, in the documentary he was bitchin about how he makes the least and some one, cant remember who, said something to the effect that he was lucky to even be in and he got all pissed and left.
But want to hear Masta Killa get his shine on, go track down his album, No Said Date, great album, RZA engineers it and it's classic Wu.
GZA is fuckin tight and my favorite MC of the Wu, plus Liquid Swords is a top ten album of all time.
The industry impact they made is incredible, the group was signed together and each member was allowed to sign solo deals, which is unprecedented at that time and that deal was negotiated by RZA. They had their own sound and they had a clothing line basically before any rappers not named LL. They built an empire on the RZA's mind and things started to fall apart when he stepped aside as he promised he would when they got to the apex. Pac loved them too, they were the only East Coast rappers he gave mad props to. Their influence can't be over stated. Then GZA, RZA, Method Man and Ghostface Killah all had platinum solo albums and Raekwon's Only Built for Cuban Linx is considered a classic and Masta Killa's No Said Date got high praise too. Plus, no group ever sold 8 million copies, original run, of an album. They're impact and mainstream success, plus their individual success that basically stream from the same sound prove if anything, WU Tang is far from over rated in any form, if anything, they are under rated.
Run DMC? Impact, hell yes they are very important to main stream hip hop success, but they're no more important or thugged as LL. Just sayin...