Lesnar vs. Orton Match Discussed

[SAIYANS]

Doesn't really matter since Brock

1 - can fuck anyone up on this planet legitimately
2 - talked like that in every UFC press conference

It would be like complaining about mayweathers promos on Big Show when it is normal for him to talk shit the way he did.

 

[Keith]

You don't see how it was awful? Did you watch it? It goes beyond having a goofy accent. He clearly forgot everything he was supposed to say and was fumbling around like a deer in the headlights. He was utterly LOST.

I'm not even expecting Austin level mic work, but that wasn't even Ziggler level mic work. He fucking sucked, and like I said, it goes beyond just not being good in the traditional sense. He was flat out CLUELESS.

I think it looked worse because what he was saying wasn't that interesting. To me Lesnar does have that heel swagger on the mic, he is never going to be fantastic, but
he is good enough depending on who he is feuding with.

The problem here is that Brock and Randy are both better heels than faces. Out of the two Lesnar is maybe more believeble as a face purely because he doesn't change his character that much, whereas Orton comes off as a different guy when he switches. I do agree that the promos won't be great and beyond the fact that these are two youngest WWE Champions in history the feud does not have much appeal to me.

The test for Lesnar will be weather he can be consistant and be the all round packenge and the guy who can carry lesser talents in the ring. That is something he didn't prove before and that is the test tomorrow night against Cena.

 

[AF.]

I liked Lesnar's promo.

 

[Blujay]

The match itself has me intrigued because I can't remember the last time Orton went into a match looking like the legitimate underdog. The match would have to resort to Orton's finesse because no one is going to buy that Orton could actually kick Lesnar's ass. I kind of hold my judgment for Lesnar's work until after Sunday since, ya know, its been about 8 years since Brock has worked a match. Unless he's been working matches on the side and has been working his ass off this past month Iron Man might be a little rusty.

As far as promos go, I'd dread that. Make it an intense physical feud that doesn't rely too much on the mic skills because between the two they combine to an average mic worker at best.

I'm definitely interested in this match though. My question is do you think Lesnar would work some Tuesdays for the program for a Smackdown rating bump?

 

[Troy]

Once Lesnar finishes his feud with Cena he is going to need someone else to feud with before he faces The Rock and Orton is the number two guy in the company so the report is just common sense. Should produce a quality match but the promos wont be that exciting from Orton's end, not sure why so many hated on Lesnar's promo because I enjoyed it on RAW. I guess because it wasn't the same format that we hear every single week people hated it. Before this feud happens they need to boost Orton's profile because it has dropped dramatically since moving to Smackdown, when he first moved there he was just beneath Cena whereas now there is a massive gap between him and Cena again. Build him up so that people do see him as a true top star and the feud with Lesnar will probably help him become a bigger star because he will get the rub from Lesnar.

 

[John McHenry]

Orton will the be taking yet another loss, he may win against Kane but how many losses can he take while still pretending to be one of the top guys.

 

[Troy]

He hasn't had that many losses since he moved to Smackdown. Yeah he lost to Kane at WM, then last year he dropped his title to Henry and lost the rematch and he lost his title to Christian due to a dodgy DQ call. That is all I can remember on PPV, other than that he was winning and he held the World title for almost four months out of eight months he was on Smackdown last year and remember that he missed a bit of time due to injury as well. He has to still be considered one of the top guys in the company, who else other than semi retired guys like Undertaker and HHH would be ahead of him?

 

[Keith]

Orton is starting to prove more and more than he is a company player, and to put over Kane at Mania he deserves big respect, but yeah I agree he still hasn't lost that much.

Thing with Lesnar you have to find the right balance between saying this guy is a mega star and is going to be a big part of the company moving forward, but at the same time you can't have him killing everyone epsically the main event players WWE have spent so long on. For example I don't think Brock should be placed above a guy like Punk in the pecking order. Okay this match with Cena maybe justifed as the main event, but after that he should work his way up to the top.

 

[Troy]

Orton is a company guy and WWE probably know that they can ask him to play second fiddle a bit more because he is never going to leave WWE and go to TNA.

With Lesnar WWE probably only have him for one year and they need to keep him as a huge star throughout in order to keep people interested. The thing is Lesnar can't simply become another guy because he isn't another guy, he is a bigger name and draw than everyone in the company. He needs to keep winning but at the same time I agree that he shouldn't be squashing anyone, they should look competitive so that they don't fall further after he leaves.

 

[Cwalker]

Orton is starting to prove more and more than he is a company player, and to put over Kane at Mania he deserves big respect, but yeah I agree he still hasn't lost that much.

Thing with Lesnar you have to find the right balance between saying this guy is a mega star and is going to be a big part of the company moving forward, but at the same time you can't have him killing everyone epsically the main event players WWE have spent so long on. For example I don't think Brock should be placed above a guy like Punk in the pecking order. Okay this match with Cena maybe justifed as the main event, but after that he should work his way up to the top.

The problem with this is, in terms of marketability Brock is higher than Punk. Brock has become bigger than WWE thanks to his run in UFC.

And because of that, every match, every feud has to be big. He can't start with Cena and then move onto Swagger. Lesnar is going to get the big names. Cena, Orton, presumably Punk and rumored Rock.

Brock's only around for a year. They need to make money off him, and they're not going to do it by starting him at the bottom and working his way up

 

[Keith]

First of all we don't know that WWE only have him for one year. The guy has retired from UFC and is still fairly young, so if he got the right deal from WWE I don't see why he couldn't stick around awhile.

It remains to be seen if he is the biggest draw in the company, but even if he is that is not the point. To have Lesnar run through everyone just because he is the big name back in town would be them thinking short term again, just like they did with The Rock. Besides it wouldn't benefit Brock, because for big feuds to work, he has to be facing guys who are considered worthy. CM Punk is the WWE Champion, and whoever holds that title should be booked as the most important wrestler in the company otherwise whats the point?

 

[Troy]

It is safe to assume one year because although he is young we do know that he hates the travel schedule WWE has plus we also know that he has suffered some pretty serious internal injuries so his body may not be able to handle another three years.

Lesnar had 7 fights in UFC and the lowest buyrate was 600k and four of those events drew over 1 million PPV buys with one drawing 1.6 million buys which is UFC's highest by half a million buys and is easily higher than anything WWE has drawn. He is a massive draw and is a bigger name than anyone in WWE including Cena because Lesnar has a lot more mainstream media than Cena. It is short term to have him run through guys but it would be financial suicide to have Lesnar return and then lose his first or second match. That would kill the buzz and in turn kill the buyrates and ratings. Lesnar needs to win his first few matches and then maybe you have him lose to someone like a Punk or Sheamus or Cena.

I kind of agree with your point about the WWE champion being the top guy in the company but sometimes there have to be exceptions to the rule. The Rock and Brock Lesnar are above the title right now because it would be a waste having them win the title when they aren't going to be around and it would hurt the title more if they won it and then left. It is tough but there is no way you can try to claim that for example the Punk vs. Jericho match is more important than Lesnar vs. Cena even though the first one has the title. Every now and then something special happens and you need it to occur away from the title and it ends up being more important than the title.

 

[Keith]

Then you might as well kill the company Troy, because if Lesnar is only there for a year and he fucks over the likes of Punk before leaving then WWE will be right back where the started. Besides just because Lesnar is the biggest draw does not mean he should win every match. In Pro Wrestling winning or losing are not the be all or end or, if it is booked in the correct way fans can buy it. For example you could say Brock might be ring rusty having been away eight years. WWE and UFC are different, different audiences, different concepts.

I still think if they offered Lesnar a Triple H style deal where he only wrestles three or four big matches a year, and made the odd raw show then he might be tempted to sign long term. Don't get me wrong I am pleased he is back, but lets not get ahead of ourselves, this could still back fire on WWE.

 

[Cwalker]

There was once upon a time where that was true. The champion was the most important guy in the company. It's not like that anymore. Contrary to what a lot of people want to believe, it is all about who draws the most money. It's a business. The top priority of a business? To make money.

Lesnar, Rock, Cena, there's a reason why they're all featured more prominently than Punk, they bring in money. Not only that, they bring in fans from other dynamics, not just wrestling. You can't really say the same about Punk.

Sometimes thinking for the short term is better. Last year when CM Punk walked out with the WWE Championship, it would have been wise to keep him off TV for months, but the angle was so hot that they brought him back right away. Why? To sell Summerslam.

At the end of the day, that's what it's all about, making money. Not "people power" or respecting the titles. Vince McMahon wants more money in his pockets. And he knows that Lesnar vs Cena is going to make him more money than anything short of Rock vs Cena

 

[Troy]

Then you might as well kill the company Troy, because if Lesnar is only there for a year and he fucks over the likes of Punk before leaving then WWE will be right back where the started. Besides just because Lesnar is the biggest draw does not mean he should win every match. In Pro Wrestling winning or losing are not the be all or end or, if it is booked in the correct way fans can buy it. For example you could say Brock might be ring rusty having been away eight years. WWE and UFC are different, different audiences, different concepts.

I still think if they offered Lesnar a Triple H style deal where he only wrestles three or four big matches a year, and made the odd raw show then he might be tempted to sign long term. Don't get me wrong I am pleased he is back, but lets not get ahead of ourselves, this could still back fire on WWE.

You made my point for me. Winning and losing is the be all or end all. Guys like Cena, Orton and Punk can each take one loss from Lesnar because those individual loses make something much bigger in a big winning streak for Lesnar. Plus even if Punk loses to Lesnar it could be done in a fashion when he ends up losing a competitive match rather than a one sided squash. Also when I say that Lesnar should win every match I am basing that on the assumption that he will wrestle less than half a dozen times. I don't expect him to win on PPV every single month because that would be unrealistic and would hurt the company. Lesnar winning four matches spread throughout the year doesn't hurt the company long term.