What's your viewpoint on Independent Wrestling matches in general, like this intergender match...

[Aztecwarrior480]

for example?




My viewpoint on this match for example, is very poor and heavily botched. I'm not too bothered by the fact that it's an intergender match involving a man beating a woman up, I'm bothered by the poor booking and how the male wrestler horribly botched his chairshot and powerbomb(throwing her, almost landing on her neck first near the turnbuckle) which could have paralyzed the female wrestler or even killed her. I also wonder, what the hell's up with the male wrestler's pink tighty whities as his wrestling attire, lol? Is this suppose to be a violent intergender wrestling porn match? The only positive thing I have to say about this match is how they don't limit their wrestlers from certain things that would have gained so much outrage and controversy had it been a mainstream pro wrestling promotion/organization/corporation like the WWE.

What's your perspective on this?

 

[Butters!]

There are matches out there that appeal to "wrestling" fans in certain ways, this however is just... not something i would call "Wrestling.". I have a much more offensive word for it, that i will keep to myself.

If we're going to speak intergender matches in general, I would say that WWE has executed it the best. They really know how to work in that match and normally it gets the fans pumped up. You're bringing in two divisions that are normally strangers to one another and forcing them to work together as a team. It's a unqiue match that i would like to see down in NXT often. They are the only ones who i currently have faith in when it comes to the ladies.

Here are two intergender matches i've personally enjoyed and that have been executed to perfection. Sure there's room for improvement, but these are some good examples.

 

[Leo C]

Um... it's hard to generalize indy wrestling as a whole, there are hundreds of different promotions with many different styles. As far as intergender gargabe matches go, well, I guess I'm not really a fan lol

 

[Wacokid27]

I have a few problems with the "match" in the OP.

1) First (and probably least from my perspective as a wrestling fan), I don't care for inter-gender matches. It's just my temperament and raising, I guess. They just don't entertain me. I don't object to them as a thing, they don't offend me, I just don't enjoy them. If I'm going to watch women in a match, I'd rather watch them against other women. The point about WWE doing inter-gender well, I would point out that WWE hasn't done an actual inter-gender match in years. They do what they call (and a term that has been adopted elsewhere) mixed-tag matches which require the men in the match to tag out when a woman is tagged in. And, when there is violence between men and women in the WWE today, it is 97% woman-on-man (women slapping men, hitting men, etc.) which doesn't bother me at all. As far as I'm concerned, you can just keep the men and women in separate matches altogether.

2) People who want to be professional wrestlers really need to attend reputable wrestling schools. These schools teach how to deliver moves in a safe (well, safer) way and also how to take moves and falls in a similar way. Chris Dickinson and Kimber Lee have pretty decent reputations as "indy wrestlers" go and even the best of the best professional wrestlers with all the training, experience, and expertise they can have available screw up and people get hurt, but I would have to know how the ground rules were discussed and laid out between the workers, bookers, agents, etc., before the match before I could really say whether or not I have a problem with what happened in the match. If she was "up for whatevs, lol", then what happened was a great way for a heel to get heat by beating up a face in a manner that was within the established "rules of the match". If she was unaware how far he was planning to take things, then I might feel differently.

3) I'm not a big fan of hardcore wrestling. Despite the rose-tinted glasses through which ECW is often remembered, what most entertained me about their matches were the ones that were closer to being technical masterpieces featuring international talents who were not widely-known in the U.S. and were getting their first real shots at exposure in this country than the "garbage matches" where it was all about exploding barbed wire chairs. I can really enjoy the inclusion of a "hardcore-style" stipulation in a match, don't get me wrong; I just like that stipulation to have a purpose beyond "we like it when they bleed huh-huh". Again, though, this is a case where I don't know the backstory on the match, so it's hard to judge the action. If there was a backstory that lends itself to a "hardcore intergender match", then the hardcore stip is certainly justified, so far as the storyline goes. It certainly seems from the reaction to the activity in the match that there's a bigger match on the horizon between Dickinson and Kimber Lee's boyfriend or whatever, so this may have some bearing on the stipulation being justified in my eyes as a fan of pro wrestling.

wk

 

[Aztecwarrior480]

There are matches out there that appeal to "wrestling" fans in certain ways, this however is just... not something i would call "Wrestling.". I have a much more offensive word for it, that i will keep to myself.

If we're going to speak intergender matches in general, I would say that WWE has executed it the best. They really know how to work in that match and normally it gets the fans pumped up. You're bringing in two divisions that are normally strangers to one another and forcing them to work together as a team. It's a unqiue match that i would like to see down in NXT often. They are the only ones who i currently have faith in when it comes to the ladies.

Here are two intergender matches i've personally enjoyed and that have been executed to perfection. Sure there's room for improvement, but these are some good examples.

Lucha Underground actually does a pretty good job of intergener matches too, possibly even better than the WWE does. Here's two examples for you.



Despite that intergender matches never really offend me at all, I'm still not quite the big fan of it. It's mostly because it usually doesn't create a very good story angle or good wrestling matches(while there are definately some exceptions like the intergender matches that we provided here on our posts) and it also sometimes bait some idiot casual fans into this stupid battle of the sexes debate that I just never really had any interest in participating. For most parts, I prefer pro wrestlers competing in their own gender divisions as long as as the wrestling promotion doesn't limit their female wrestlers from utilizing their talents or doing that's that typically only the male wrestlers are allowed to do.

 

[Aztecwarrior480]

Um... it's hard to generalize indy wrestling as a whole, there are hundreds of different promotions with many different styles. As far as intergender gargabe matches go, well, I guess I'm not really a fan lol

Yeah, like I already just said to Butters, even though intergender matches never really offended me at all, I'm still not quite the big fan of it either. It's mostly because it usually doesn't create a very good story angle or good wrestling matches(while there are definately some exceptions) and it also sometimes bait some idiot casual fans into this stupid battle of the sexes debating crap that I just never really had any interest in participating. For most parts, I prefer pro wrestlers competing in their own gender divisions as long as the wrestling promotion doesn't limit their female wrestlers from utilizing their talents to the fullest or doing that's that typically only the male wrestlers are allowed to do in the vast majority of the top tier pro wrestling organizations.

 

[Aztecwarrior480]

I have a few problems with the "match" in the OP.

1) First (and probably least from my perspective as a wrestling fan), I don't care for inter-gender matches. It's just my temperament and raising, I guess. They just don't entertain me. I don't object to them as a thing, they don't offend me, I just don't enjoy them. If I'm going to watch women in a match, I'd rather watch them against other women. The point about WWE doing inter-gender well, I would point out that WWE hasn't done an actual inter-gender match in years. They do what they call (and a term that has been adopted elsewhere) mixed-tag matches which require the men in the match to tag out when a woman is tagged in. And, when there is violence between men and women in the WWE today, it is 97% woman-on-man (women slapping men, hitting men, etc.) which doesn't bother me at all. As far as I'm concerned, you can just keep the men and women in separate matches altogether.

2) People who want to be professional wrestlers really need to attend reputable wrestling schools. These schools teach how to deliver moves in a safe (well, safer) way and also how to take moves and falls in a similar way. Chris Dickinson and Kimber Lee have pretty decent reputations as "indy wrestlers" go and even the best of the best professional wrestlers with all the training, experience, and expertise they can have available screw up and people get hurt, but I would have to know how the ground rules were discussed and laid out between the workers, bookers, agents, etc., before the match before I could really say whether or not I have a problem with what happened in the match. If she was "up for whatevs, lol", then what happened was a great way for a heel to get heat by beating up a face in a manner that was within the established "rules of the match". If she was unaware how far he was planning to take things, then I might feel differently.

3) I'm not a big fan of hardcore wrestling. Despite the rose-tinted glasses through which ECW is often remembered, what most entertained me about their matches were the ones that were closer to being technical masterpieces featuring international talents who were not widely-known in the U.S. and were getting their first real shots at exposure in this country than the "garbage matches" where it was all about exploding barbed wire chairs. I can really enjoy the inclusion of a "hardcore-style" stipulation in a match, don't get me wrong; I just like that stipulation to have a purpose beyond "we like it when they bleed huh-huh". Again, though, this is a case where I don't know the backstory on the match, so it's hard to judge the action. If there was a backstory that lends itself to a "hardcore intergender match", then the hardcore stip is certainly justified, so far as the storyline goes. It certainly seems from the reaction to the activity in the match that there's a bigger match on the horizon between Dickinson and Kimber Lee's boyfriend or whatever, so this may have some bearing on the stipulation being justified in my eyes as a fan of pro wrestling.

wk

I see where you come from. On your viewpoint towards intergender matches, my take on it(which I just told the other two on this thread) is even though intergender matches never really offended me at all, I'm still not quite the big fan of it either. It's mostly because it usually doesn't create a very good story angle or good wrestling matches(while there are definately some exceptions) and it also sometimes bait some idiot casual fans into this stupid battle of the sexes debating crap that I just never really had any interest in participating. For most parts, I prefer pro wrestlers competing in their own gender divisions as long as as the wrestling promotion doesn't limit their female wrestlers from making the best use of their talents or doing things that typically only the male wrestlers are allowed to do in the vast majority of the major wrestling promotions.

#6Aztecwarrior480, A moment ago

 

[BradR]

I'm not think Intergender matches are good at all. Okay, the women aren't too bad but the story, as said, is just poor and the fighting isn't entertaining like if you had two men or two women. Not a big fan of it.

 

[Stopspot]

First off OP: That vid you linked wasn't a match. It was an angle.

On the topic of independent wrestling: Majority of the wrestling I watch is either independent or from Japan. I don't care too much for WWE's flashy lights, overly produced and overly scripted matches, when WWE wrestling is done well it is super good, but most of the time it is meh. The independent scene is more gritty and gives wrestlers more freedom, something I enjoy in my wrestling. Plus the pallet is so big I can get just about anything on the independent scene or from Mexico and Japan.

On intergender wrestling: When done right it is good, but there aren't many promotions who do it right.

 

[Aztecwarrior480]

First off OP: That vid you linked wasn't a match. It was an angle.

On the topic of independent wrestling: Majority of the wrestling I watch is either independent or from Japan. I don't care too much for WWE's flashy lights, overly produced and overly scripted matches, when WWE wrestling is done well it is super good, but most of the time it is meh. The independent scene is more gritty and gives wrestlers more freedom, something I enjoy in my wrestling. Plus the pallet is so big I can get just about anything on the independent scene or from Mexico and Japan.

On intergender wrestling: When done right it is good, but there aren't many promotions who do it right.

If there one one thing I liked about the Indie wrestling, Mexican wrestling and Japanese wrestling over the WWE, they never limit their female wrestlers from their talents and allow them to do things that mostly the male wrestlers were allowed to do and participate in. Then again, I'm starting to like Mexican wrestling and Japanese wrestling over any American pro wrestling organization at this moment because of the fact that the pro wrestling organizations in Mexico and Japan actually make the best use of all their talents and not misuse them, unlike the WWE.

 

[Messiah1]

I love Indy wrestling, but i can't stand intergender matches. It's one of the reasons i don't watch Lucha Underground anymore. If a woman is beating up a man twice her size, it's hard for me to buy that at all. If it's an angle i'm fine with that, but the woman should always stick to wrestling the woman, imo.

 

[Bort]

Intergender matches are awesome when done right, i.e. Sara Del Rey and Saturyne in Chikara.

 

[Bort]

The absolute state of wrestling marks in 2015:

I love Indy wrestling, but i can't stand intergender matches. It's one of the reasons i don't watch Lucha Underground anymore. If a woman is beating up a man twice her size, it's hard for me to buy that at all. If it's an angle i'm fine with that, but the woman should always stick to wrestling the woman, imo.